Suggestion: Mann Co. Supply Crate Key at 2.77–3 ref

Conclusion: 2.88 ref is now the going price of keys and is even difficult to find on outpost because of the fact that sellers are always wanting more for their keys. On top of that, 3 refined sales are common. If the website is true in saying that it shows the current price of items, then I believe a price increase is necessary. Before someone says “oh but I can buy keys in trade servers at a lower price”, that may be true, but on a whole average 2.77 refined to 3 refined is the average price of a key.

If more links are necessary it can be arranged

I think the upper end should be moved to 3 ref, (for the current price, not the suggested) I often get keys and immediately change them to metal since I know I can get 3 ref for it and buy at 2.77 if I need them. Upvoted for my part, but no guarantees how this will go.

for once....upvote, good proof, we all need to stop holding on to the older price clearly something must change

I'm gonna use brad's argument here.

Since the 2.66-2.88 suggestion was rejected because 2.66 keys were flying away too fast, allow me to counter.

All of the 2.88 buyers have either closed their trades or have been swarmed with add requests within 12 hours.

That should be an indicator that 2.88 is high enough that sellers want to get rid of keys at that price.

I expect an extremely negative score on this comment because of "butthurt", but 2.66 sales are still fairly common, as well as 2.77 buyers. The problem I'm seeing in both the lowering and raising suggestions is nobody really seems to care about the opposite end of the spectrum.

Leave the keys where they are: middle ground.

I see your concern that many of the links have closed.

I went through outpost buying keys links yet again

http://www.tf2outpost.com/trade/6671202 - Buying for 2.88

http://www.tf2outpost.com/trade/6641817 - Buying for 2.88

http://www.tf2outpost.com/trade/6715604 - Buying for 2.88

http://www.tf2outpost.com/trade/6687278 - Buying for 2.88

http://www.tf2outpost.com/trade/6714880 - Buying for 2.88

http://www.tf2outpost.com/trade/6674758 - Buying for 2.88

http://www.tf2outpost.com/trade/6677717 - Buying for 2.88

http://www.tf2outpost.com/trade/6716361 - Buying for 2.88

http://www.tf2outpost.com/trade/6671202 - Buying for 2.88

Hopefully these are not repeats

If many people are buying at 2.88 then I think 2.88 should be considered middle ground

nobody is buying keys at 3 ref now, stop overpricing like ... don't be like those crap seller hanging on to this old inflation, downvoted of course

sigh...did you even look at the proof

http://www.tf2outpost.com/trade/6697631

and that's only 3 hours old

sigh... damn you're right that's hell of a proof

http://www.tf2outpost.com/trade/4686244

http://www.tf2outpost.com/trade/6698516

http://www.tf2outpost.com/trade/6328751

http://www.tf2outpost.com/trade/6349857

http://www.tf2outpost.com/trade/6651053

I took the 5 first links i found, there must be only 1 buying link of 3 ref on outpost so don't expect us to take it as an indisputable proof

Yes I realize there are many trying to buy for 2.66, but those trades are slow and do not have much activity. And as for the one buying link on the outpost comment, that is why I posted the 7 links for buying at 2.88 which is the medium price. If i was raising the price to 3 ref for keys, I could see your concern

Dude. so many people just post this to troll and pretend theyre buying keys just so the price rises. thats like no proof at all. still downvoting

I am only changing the price to 2.88 not 3 ref, anyway more links

http://www.tf2outpost.com/trade/6706353 - Buying for 3 refined

http://www.tf2outpost.com/trade/6706247 - Buying for 3 refined

http://www.tf2outpost.com/trade/6685388 - Buying for 2.88 refined

http://www.tf2outpost.com/trade/6688095 - Buying for 2.88 refined

http://www.tf2outpost.com/trade/6706181 - Buying for 2.88 refined

http://www.tf2outpost.com/trade/6691666 - Buying for 2.88 refined

http://www.tf2outpost.com/trade/6698703 - Buying for 2.88 refined

If this doesn't convince then I simply give up

If Outpost decides to implement sorting of trades by price then I would 100% agree with you.

I know a trade that has been buying Keys at 2.88 for over a week, still haven't bought the quantity needed.

Information is not perfect in the market. Now that the buyers have bumped their price, it takes a short while for the 2.66 sellers to notice.

We just need to wait until most 2.66 transactions disappear, or if 3.11 ref appears. It's getting there as we speak.

This is the same guy in the first link, I added him and asked him if he was trolling

http://i.imgur.com/lgZ1V.png

He also has new keys in his backpack

Edit: annd the other guy http://i.imgur.com/oW6gx.png

Look, this is good proof and all, but if this passes, I will single-handedly murder every single backpacktf admin.

Disclaimer: I will not actually murder every single backpacktf admin. I will just shake my fist at them menacingly.

Because I was the one who posted this same price suggestion. Do you know how long ago that was? YESTERDAY.

Here is the evidence I showed of me buying keys for 2.66 ref from 11-28 and yesterday. It can be done, it really is not hard. The problem is most buyers are impatient. The last guy I bought some from was offering me 9 keys but I ran out of ref at the time.

http://imgur.com/YRSvG

http://imgur.com/UmGFC

http://imgur.com/7JkXt

I'm not saying that it's impossible to get keys at 2.66, but if you look at my proof you will see that many are paying 2.88 refined for keys. I also show 100+ being sold at 3 refined.

Don't mind me asking: Are you gullible?

Just because people state they sold 66, 29, 25 at 3 ref each doesn't mean they really sold that amount at that price. Especially when most of them are buying to resell

You might have a point, but I don't think that they are all lying. I wanted to include those links because most sellers would just have "out of stock" or "2 left" and I couldn't tell how many they sold. This was my only way. Anyway pic related

http://i.imgur.com/Cyhkj.jpg

Well first i thought all these 3ref sellers were lying on their Sale-numbers.

But i put a few Keys on Outpost yesterday (since all my 2.88 Keys sold in a few Minutes) for 3 refined, and sold them after a few Hours to 2 Guys.

Problem is, that mainly big (re)sellers have a high key-stock, so if you want many keys at once, you WILL have to pay 3

I think a 1 scrap range is better, even if trades can occur at 2.66 and 3 refined. Should be either 2.77-2.88 or 2.88-3.

This is not how the site works. Prices are not set based on personal opinions, what you think should happen, or what you want to happen. It is based on what people are currently paying for the item.

Proof is almost always required, and it must show sales that actually went through and not just buyout prices. It is recommended to show plenty of proof, not just one or two links, as those can just be luck.

Please don't make these mistakes again. Thank you.

Who is the original author?

LaggyLaptop

If you're going to lecture me like I'm new to backpack.tf at least do it in your own words. Thanks.

Why would I do it in my own words when LaggyLaptop did it for me?

We should just put up a 2.66-3 range and be done with messing with keys forever. To many opinions and trades. People buy successfully at 2.66, 2.77, 2.88 and 3, yet none of the suggestions for the past 2 weeks have accommodated for all if these trades.

You can't put up 2.66-3 ref because it has the same average value as 2.77-2.88 ref

That doesn't make any sense...The current price range of most key trades vary at either 2.66, 2.77 and so on. Key value range is in an inconsistent time, so there should be a wider range until the mass confusion and paranoia dies down.

No I mean you literally cannot suggest 2.66-3 ref because the average value would equal 2.83 ref. The average of 2.77-2.88 ref also equals 2.83 ref. You cannot suggest a new price with the same average value even if the higher and lower ends are different.

Oh, I see. You mean the site blocks suggestions like that?

Yes, you have to have a slight variation when suggesting a new price.

Thanks, I guess I missed that in the help section or wherever that important info was put.

I have no idea where that information is. :P

I just know from experience with all my price suggestions.

I think the 2.66 trades and many of the 2.77 have died out (2.77 is in the range), and therefore 2.66 doesn't seem to be necessary anymore.

Because why would anyone settle for 2.66 when there are plenty of 2.88 buyers and an even more massive amount of 2.77 buyers.

Today I was desperate for keys, so I bought 4 of them at 3 ref each.

I'm really not sure about this, because 3 ref seems a price desperate people would pay. I'd love it if buds and key prices auto synced with tf2finance.

I have so say though, I bought some at 2.88 before. The last ones at 3 ref.

But wouldn't "3 ref seems a price desperate people would pay" mean that it should at least be on the high end? I appreciate your input btw

I'm not sure what to think, honestly. If it were any other item, it would be like people overpaying for something because they really want/need it. I think I overpayed, but I really needed them.

Please dear god no

keys cost 2 euro at shop!!

1 ref cost 75 euro cents

if the keys goes up to 3 ref then valve will eventually rise the price of the keys to ballance the situation

DOWNVOTED

...what?

When can you buy refined from valve...?

mate its not in anyones profit an expensive tooll drop system is at 0.55 ref per player in a week an expensive key would ultimetly drag people away from buying and that could cause serius problems in tf2 economy the uncraters will go unhappy

the buyers and the sellers too

still if you want to get keys the cheaper solution right now is the store

you dont need to have keys to trade though i buy 8.33 ref any item that cost 3 keys

i bought unusuall fro that the seller was for 24 keys pure with 64.33 refs!!!!!

just to test my theory!'so no i think keys must range somewhere between 2.33-2.66 max and thats my advice to anyone whos trading!dont accept keys they rip you off what is matter in the end of the day is who got the most refs and not keys!! thats why backpacks get the 2000 slot upgrade wake up everybody valve eventually will achieve to manipulate the market whatever trade posts are truying to achieve for there own means.cheers have a nice one!!

WHEN CAN YOU BUY METAL FROM VALVE?

irrelevent mate

metal is the only item that can mesure prices

its not for sale!noob.

"keys cost 2 euro at shop!!

1 ref cost 75 euro cents"

U wot m8?

I'm not saying keys should rise.

Also, ECONOMOLOGIST? Pretty sure you're trolling right now.

Valves "strategy"? You mean the one where they make no hat under 5$?

Also, if you're using google translate... Don't. You're not making an ounce of sense.

garouflis is valves economologist i am not doing to you any more comments google read post it might take you a little to read it so dont post nothing like does voalve sell metal!!

read the erticle about the equilibrium get an idea of what refs are then repost .

I think he knows nothing about the Grey market, just like the economist from the near-default country.

and the last update that put an end in the uncraftables is part of valves strategy

...

would you bought a voodoo juju for 10 $ in the shop??if it was to be uncrafted?

if it was clean??

do you think valve is willing to stand there and watch those cash opportunities go buy?

dont think so..

just wait till 2013..valve will put every single hat and misc up to the store period!!!

thats why items have the origin faction on them

just read the article about manncononomy from that great greek economologist that works for valve!and the mysteries will vanish! cheers and you better get rid of every single rare item you got cause the only rarety will be the vintages everything else will be obtainable by the store and as for the key prices

valve can just put the on a 10% sale next day without a notice and influance the market in an hour!

and the choose to do it now that vintages are near extinction look at all the major collectors how they have manipulate the market the last 2 years just to get there hands on the vintages

naknak is one example go figure mate i am done here do whatever with the keys price if i think something is overpriced i will simple wont pay my refs for it?

Vintages aren't near extinction... sure there's some expensive ones, but they all have somewhat of a market.

naknak owns 1.5% of Vintage Masks visible by public, how is that extinction?

http://www.tf2outpost.com/trade/6620816

Your offer:

'i have an offer but is sliced overpay!'

'in items about 28 keys in items and refs!!'

'24.11 ref! white essential accesories 2 mercs pride scarfs 1 fast lerner'

'almost 28 keys'

'i bought unusuall fro that the seller was for 24 keys pure with 64.33 refs!!!!!'

The seller's B/O was 25 keys.

You sir are a liar and don't use google translate.

If you have any keys, I would lovely pay 2.33 ref-2.66 ref for them.

Up vote

As much as it pains me to upvote, I did look at someone selling their keys for 2.88 and someone bought them in about 10 seconds once it was posted.

I'm going to upvote this, but I expect there to be a 2.66 - 2.88 suggestion again tomorrow. I would love for a suggestion of 2.66 - 3 and leave it be.

players with backpacks worth 300- USD shouldn't be eligible to vote on currency items . anyway i upvote, because i myself can't buy a key for 2.88 and do a lot of successful trades selling at 3 ref.

do you mean >$300? And why? (I don't see your logic at all here)

I think he means

players with cheap backpacks dont have experience, people who downvote have cheap backpacks, people who upvote know the pain to get a key and know how easy they are to sell at 3 ref

I recently bought a key for 3 refined, but I had to bump my trade 5 times before anyone added me

I don't even want this to pass. But its inevitable. Some things in life just happen whether you like it or not. That's the deal with death, that's the deal with tf2 keys.

I'll make an announcement on the website where I will write, that I buy keys for 5.00. Will call my friends to pretend that there are some people are interested. And everyone will think that it is time to rewrite the price lists. Yahoo!...

Have to pay for the key 4 refs! 5 refs...

Oh, God. I hope these speculators are digging their own grave.

Votting down.

backpack.tf reports the average selling price. I doubt you have the capacity to keep buying keys for very long. Plenty of people are fine with buying and selling keys between 2.77-3 ref. No one who is smart is going to put up a suggestion of 5 ref because one person decided to buy for that amount. Too much of the key market is selling below that range. I think you are simply exaggerating the situation. Also backpack.tf is not a trendsetter, it simply follows the trend. That means it reports the most up-to-date prices, but people may always go higher or lower, and that is what allows for price changes to occur.

OK I tried this today, I needed 5 keys.....for few hours I tried I couldn't get a key for 2.77 ref + 1 wep. The minute I changed it to 2.88 ref I got 3 requests and bought 5 keys easily. So 2.77-2.88 still seems fair to me. You can get keys for 2.88 easily, 2.77 if you try really hard

3 ref is just too much

Downvote

But actually they ARE easy to sell for 3 refined!

Upvote. I have sold keys at 2.88, bought at 2.77, and even sold at 3 refined in the past. It may be the death of the TF2 economy, but keys are at this price range.

Why are keys going up in price? Its pointless... They havent changed in the slightest. If someone has a GOOD reason and not a pointless one please tell me.

Key prices are rising because

1. There are many buying at lower and selling at higher.

2. Some wouldn't mind spending 1-2 extra scrap buying keys from the first online seller they see, instead of waiting around to buy for more decent prices.

So the cheaper ones are all sold out, and people who genuinely want keys to uncrate or just keep inventory smaller will just have to make-do with more expensive keys.

And because of pro idlers making valueless refined

Just stupid, if we put them on 2.77-3.00 people will just try to take 3.11-3.33.

But no one will buy them, when keys were 2.55 people wanted 2.66 but they weren't commonly bought. It's not like there is a monopoly of keys selleres that decide on a set price

Okay, I'm still hung up on why a freaking backpacktf admin accepted the price change by Ghost Akrra when it had -142 votes............................ WHY? I DON'T GET YOU ADMINS LOGIC!

Alright, even though I dislike the admins, I still support this suggestion.

You see, here's how this works:

Every year about this time, lots of people go on an unboxing splurge. Which means they need keys.

Which means people are sold out very quickly

Which means the people who still have keys sell for higher prices

After it's all over, the prices still remain.

If someone starts selling for the original price, then he'll be bought out instantly only for the person to immediately resell the keys for more

So basically... SUPPLY AND DEMAND

On that note... Upvote!

The supply of keys is actually going up. It only went down for halloween. Check meet the stats. Demand has always been high for keys. The reason someone sells out instantly if they sell for the original price, is because so many other sellers highball.

How does this not make any sense to anyone. If all sellers started selling for 3.11 ref and you find 1 person selling for 3 ref, the 3ref seller will sell out quickly. The problem is that sellers are collectively raising the price every time they see success.

Good evidence from Citrus funk

I support this suggestion so long as no one provides adequate counter evidence of trades from the last 12 hours.

I have a buy order in at 2.77 for a few days and got 2 keys........

I have buy orders out for 2.88 this afternoon to get more love and still nothing.........

I see more activity at the 3 ref mark. And I hate this economy......

The only reason I closed the last suggestion was because of the huge voter dislike and that I agreed with base64 reasoning.

Inside, I believed that keys were approaching 3 ref each.

This time around, there is a higher voter support and the Keyref index just broke 2.88. Combined with the proof you gave and the research I have done on my own. It appears that the Key market is going up again : (