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Told myself I'd never do this, but it's both more accurate and precise than the current range. Although I'm not certain if the fact that the last suggestion passed somehow made it easier to sell at 3.66.
Here's your obligatory finance link: http://tf2finance.com/keys/
At the time of suggestion:
1/31/2013 17:52 GMT key price is 3.49 refined.
If this is way off, let me know so I'll close it.
Read your comment. Then read the suggestion. Repeat this action until realization sinks in.
1 Key = 3.54 Refined
NOW :)
So what? I don't have to prove anything, because I'm not changing anything. I'm just fixing an admin mistake of accepting a giant range that caused a bunch of confusion. They should go ahead and accept it, and if there needs to be a stepping up of the price tomorrow, then so be it. I'm not upset at the admins, I know they do the best that they can with all of the hundreds of suggestions they get, I just figured I could open this to assist making this a better price guide.
I think 3.44-3.66 is better range
Your proof has evaporated. The live key price at between 1 AM and 5 AM in America isn't very useful. It has already gone back down to 3.51
I find it odd that before the new price, it's around 3.4ish. Then bp.tf has a new price and magically it goes up to 3.55ish.
Trading late night is a really bad experience. Ignore any Finance links from that time period, they will always be way off from normal.
I love that too, infact back in december 22nd a key suggest 3.11-3.22 was suggestion..Well finnance was down, the price got accepted despite this and when it came back online there was a straight up shot in the average, wonder why?
tf2finace tracks the average of what keys sell for. Not what keys CAN sell for. This is why the range is 3.33-3.66
What they can sell for isn't useful if they aren't highly liquid at those values. At 3.33 you are not likely to be able to turn your metal into keys, and at 3.66 you are not likely to be able to turn your keys into metal. At 3.44 and 3.55 you can have moderate to high success both buying and selling.
3.33-3.66 is not a useful range. Why not just put a range of 2.33-4.66 if you want a range that includes all values?
The last suggestion showed keys go for 3.33-3.66 on trading sites like outpost. I'm on mobile right now commenting so I can't search right now. But you can always try to search for proof of 2.33-4.66 if you really want
What I'm trying to say is that 3.44-3.55 is the liquidity range (at which keys flow the fastest) while 3.33 is the discount rate for people who need metal or are uninformed and 3.66 is a premium price at which key bankers intend to make profit.
scrap.tf has bought 70+ keys today at 3.33
People are still willing to sell for less than your suggested range.
They're sold out at 3.55 when I tried a second ago.
I agree with the price range. I've sold 3 keys in the last day at 3.66.
Selling for 3.66: http://www.tf2outpost.com/trade/8304100
I also made a buying post for 3.44 to test the prices and have gotten 0 interest. http://www.tf2outpost.com/trade/8313256
My concern is that a 3.33 to 3.66 range is so useless that nobody knows what to do. You've gotten very little interest at 3.66 and none at 3.44. Giving 4 different values for keys is a bit terrifying.
The trend I see with anyone supporting a key price hike:
- Has at least 30 keys in their backpack, so they have something to gain
- Acts like an Ivy League economics student and makes elitist arguments to anyone who dares disagree with them.
- Spams tf2finance.com, and gushes over it's accuracy like the spreadsheet. Yeah, we all know how that worked for the spreadsheet
- Makes a stupid comment saying that they haven;t found a seller selling at the current low price for "a long time," which translates to a week
- Lies about how they have been able to sell at the projected high price, yet refuse to show proof.
- Cites "depreciation of refined" to further support their agenda, and not care that they have done nothing to stop keys from going into the economy.
- Spams LIMITED EDITION PROMO on something that is at best a liquid asset
- Mocks you for not having at least 15 alt accounts
- Spams that something that has a purpose (Refined Metal) is completely useless, and you are a fool for even having it.
- Are the people on outpost spamming QUICKSELL QUICKSELL QUICKSELL on unusuals.
- Think that only a complete moron would unbox crates.
- Think the best advice to new players is NEVER UNBOX, AND HIGHBALL ON KEYS SINCE IT WILL NEVER GO DOWN.
- Are only upvoting these key prices so they can brag about their backpack size like it is a sports car they will never drive, and insult anyone with what they deem to be a low amount of keys.
- Upvote any price that Brad Pitt wants to set because HURR DURR FREE EXTRA POINT OF REP.
- Would insult anyone who described an accurate list of their behaviors like I did.
- Are secretly terrible players in TF2
Now I am going to just bring a folding chair , grab a bucket of popcorn, and watch as the insults are hurled at me. I will bathe in the satisfaction that they only insulting me because I called out their behavior.
What exactly does this relate to? This suggestion is not a price hike, I only have 27 keys, and I'm an Accounting grad, not Economics student. XD
Credit where it's due though. We really need a backpack.tf thread simulator. The above is so true, that it's not even a simulation.
The rise in question is related to the low price being adjusted to a higher price.
Well, do remember that you asked for insults, but insults aren't my thing. Harsh criticism will have to do. Backpack.tf is not a holy of all holy books for the mannconomy. It's something that we all just try to as close as possible. If keys are selling for 3.33, then by all means, they can still sell. Same with all the people who want to sell for 3.66.
If you want to dictate your prices based on what's remotely possible in the economy, take a bunch of number magnets, close your eyes, and just throw them at your fridge. Price your items at whatever sticks, and you can eventually find someone who's willing to pay that.
Seriously though, your opinion on this matter isn't as much an opinion as it is bitching about change. Grow up and realize that TF2 is a VIDEOGAME and Backpack.tf is a WEBSITE. What you decide to do shouldn't be based on arrows and 2 decimal places.
I know it is only a game and this is only a website. Try telling these key sellers that, however. The way that they behave, this site and the trading aspect are their entire livelihoods, like they have nothing better to do with their lives. The way people are holding this site on a pedestal this site and tf2finance, are completely, totally, and absolutely infallible., and they should be a holy scripture. And then there are people like me who ask why.
You read the words, but skipped past the meaning. The fact that you're getting so worked up over this means that it has hit a nerve, and if a key suggestion can hit a nerve, you should rethink your nerve placement.
people never sell for the low price anymore, nor in the middle. they try to maximize profit by selling at the high price :(
I have over 300 keys in my backpack and have been saying it should have been 3.44-3.55 way before the last suggestion. Now what?
It only proves my point, dude. You have over 300 keys, translating to you having something to gain out of it. You are only upvoting for your own reasons.
You do know that this suggestion would lower the price...right?
Yes and no. It would lower the high price, but it would also be raising the low price
It would actually reconfirm the price as the symbol suggests
dude...get off this planet, you need reading eggs.com
well acualy this is 100% true, why would you expect flame 0-o
I supported the last key price raise. Let's put it to the test on me.
- Has at least 30 keys in their backpack, so they have something to gain
Wrong.
- Acts like an Ivy League economics student and makes elitist arguments to anyone who dares disagree with them.
What is an elitist argument, and when have I ever made one?
- Spams tf2finance.com, and gushes over it's accuracy like the spreadsheet. Yeah, we all know how that worked for the spreadsheet
Yeah, because a bot that tracks trades is very similar to the spreadsheet.
- Makes a stupid comment saying that they haven;t found a seller selling at the current low price for "a long time," which translates to a week
Wrong.
- Lies about how they have been able to sell at the projected high price, yet refuse to show proof.
Wrong.
- Cites "depreciation of refined" to further support their agenda, and not care that they have done nothing to stop keys from going into the economy.
This makes no sense.
- Spams LIMITED EDITION PROMO on something that is at best a liquid asset
Wrong.
- Mocks you for not having at least 15 alt accounts
Wrong.
- Spams that something that has a purpose (Refined Metal) is completely useless, and you are a fool for even having it.
Wrong.
- Are the people on outpost spamming QUICKSELL QUICKSELL QUICKSELL on unusuals.
Wrong.
- Think that only a complete moron would unbox crates.
Wrong.
- Think the best advice to new players is NEVER UNBOX, AND HIGHBALL ON KEYS SINCE IT WILL NEVER GO DOWN.
Wrong.
- Are only upvoting these key prices so they can brag about their backpack size like it is a sports car they will never drive, and insult anyone with what they deem to be a low amount of keys.
Wrong.
- Upvote any price that Brad Pitt wants to set because HURR DURR FREE EXTRA POINT OF REP.
Wrong.
- Would insult anyone who described an accurate list of their behaviors like I did.
Wrong, because it's not an accurate list.
- Are secretly terrible players in TF2
I'm not the best, but I'm playing UGC, and am nowhere near terrible.
Don't make stupid overgeneralizations.
I have more then 30 keys
I don't like when keys go up, there's nothing to gain. More to lose.
Most traders have metal, which I never accept. Making sales take longer.
But i would fit into quicksell unusual lol I hate em and if I get offered an unusual for one or more of my items, they best be counting it at quicksell price. Cause I don't want to own a dumb unusual and especially don't want to own it for longer then a day.
But I don't see what you are planning to achieve thru your comment.
@Poncho.
I hereby challenge you:
In response to your into: Is not a price hike.
In response to your "points":
-Didn't invest in keys but invested in tickets and hats which were obviously going down.
-Acts like a person who hates people with keys because of his silly investment choices and makes anti-elitist arguments. I mean seriously, your backpack value has gone down $100 in 3 months because of your choices. Sorry you majored in Art History.
-Exaggerates the atrocities of non-outpost links and no trade server screenshots. While tf2finance is not entirely accurate, it does provide a necessary bit of info. 3.49 = (3.44+3.55)/2. Simple math.
-Makes a stupid comment about without providing any proof to say otherwise.
-Sells at the low end just to prove his "point."
-http://steamcommunity.com/groups/meetthestats/discussions/0/846940247663550193/?tscn=1356372255
-Uh, no he didn't lol.
-Again, wrong. Anything beyond 14 accounts is foolish without multiple computers. And no he didn't.
-He is right. Also, he didn't spam. His comment was very clean And you're raging because you went metal instead of keys.
-Lol no he isn't: http://www.tf2outpost.com/user/117507.
-Unless you have a substantial number, better to just hold on to the keys. Logic says this due to over 70% of unusuals being below the avg number of keys spent to unbox.
-Key day-trading is a very successful operation that you failed to acknowledge. 1 scrap per 15-30 minutes is a very nice profit. Additionally, those who cannot afford to unbox should not unbox until they have a substantial number of keys (see above point).
-You have a small backpack size. And assuming it is a sports car, it is getting driven every day because the dude likes the car, not his e-phallus. Also, you like to insult anyone with what you deem to be a high amount of keys so you're just being hypocritical here. And this point has nothing to do with the suggestion.
-Again, nothing to do with the suggestion. Also of the past 5 of Pitt's recent suggestions, 2 were closed. This is a silly argument.
-Hypocritical and has nothing to do with the suggestion.
-You're most likely a terrible player at TF2. The highest points you've ever gotten without dying is 34. Additionally, judging by your times, you idle. Therefore, these points are fake too. Unlike some of us here, you don't do anything competitive either: http://www.ugcleague.com/players_page.cfm?player_id=76561198048571227.
This is just you saying you don't care when you obviously do. I don't really see any insults being hurled.
I support this price. While there are still people trying to buy for 3.22 and people trying to sell for 4 ref, with keys I feel a smaller range is better. 3.44 and 3.55 seem to be the most common prices that I've seen.
Just sold 3 keys in a matter of minutes at 3.55
upvoted.
This range is not only accurate but would also slow down the ridiculous highballing virus.
I tried to sell a key for 3.66 a few days ago, and after waiting for 2 days I had no luck, settled for 3.55 and sold on my next bump. Upvote for you.
sold 1 key to 3.66. I know this isn't a looooot of proof but it would help a bit here.
http://i.imgur.com/tTp7w5o.png
That just proves my point more. Keys are traded at such a wide range, that the only useful thing to do is to reflect an average.
Mhm, if you want to wait, it's possible to get 4 ref :/ it's sad how keys are rising, i miss uncrating
Also, 3.44-3.66 is a good range, people are offering 3.44 per key. People are selling at 3.66, but the price you suggested is close
making the price range smaller will lead to less debates on prices and on tf2finance, keys are about 3.49
Yes! You have great proof and I accept this price change Guys remember that the keys can't grow up to 6 ref that would catastrofal
*Catastrophic.
And... this is lowering the average price, not raising it. Not even close to 6 ref.
Actually, it's doing nothing to the average price whatsoever.
Too many sells at 3.66 and buys at 3.33 , i will try to come with some counter-proof later
There's only one thing that you can counter common sense with.
Backpack.tf is a pricing guide. If you receive a key in a trade, you can come here and quickly determine its average worth. What you then choose to do with that information is up to you. If you want to sell for a scrap below or above, that's your prerogative. We don't need to include all values that keys trade at, because that defeats the purpose of this being a useful guide.
SOLD FOR 3.66 :
http://www.tf2outpost.com/trade/7913358
http://www.tf2outpost.com/trade/7937234
http://www.tf2outpost.com/trade/7632518
http://www.tf2outpost.com/trade/6882406
http://www.tf2outpost.com/trade/8067369
http://www.tf2outpost.com/trade/7970864
http://www.tf2outpost.com/trade/8101660
http://www.tf2outpost.com/trade/8084714
http://www.tf2outpost.com/trade/8134815
http://www.tf2outpost.com/trade/7976951
http://www.tf2outpost.com/trade/7788846
http://www.tf2outpost.com/trade/7717313
Extra notes : A LOT of the 3.66 sell trades in my old suggestion have closed , why? OUT OF STOCK , people BUY for 3.66
SELLS FOR 3.66 :
http://www.tf2outpost.com/trade/7872577
http://www.tf2outpost.com/trade/7916934
http://www.tf2outpost.com/trade/8110683
http://www.tf2outpost.com/trade/8019106
http://www.tf2outpost.com/trade/8132846
http://www.tf2outpost.com/trade/7074064
Same conclusion , more than the 70% of the trades of my 3.66 sellers proof from my old suggestion are gone , because they have sold all of their keys for that price , 3.66 is happening A LOT.
BUYS/BOUGHT FOR 3.33 :
http://www.tf2outpost.com/trade/6882406
http://www.tf2outpost.com/trade/8067369
http://www.tf2outpost.com/trade/7285368
http://www.tf2outpost.com/trade/7787240
http://www.tf2outpost.com/trade/8082561
http://www.tf2outpost.com/trade/7918585
http://www.tf2outpost.com/trade/7727339
http://www.tf2outpost.com/trade/8105184
http://www.tf2outpost.com/trade/8125950
http://www.tf2outpost.com/trade/7763689
http://www.tf2outpost.com/trade/8005211
With the buys at 3.33 there is less success , even if scrap.tf usually gets keys at 3.33 at some specific hours. About 15% of my 3.33 buyers proof suggestion have closed because of they bought all they want.
Final conclusion : Maybe 3.33-3.66 is too big , but its the current range , we have to admit it , I think we will be able to set a 3.44-3.66 in some days , because there is much more success at 3.66 than at 3.33.
Downvote
Your proof doesn't make a very compelling argument. I see dozens of week old trades that you provided links to that still have key stock. Some of them say they are out of stock, but have 50 or 60 keys in their backpacks, and almost all of the comments are people trying to purchase for less. In fact, one of your links the guy admits that he doesn't sell very fast at 3.66, but he would feel like he was losing if he sold for less.
If you've been around long enough to remember, keys flow more freely when there's a clean established range. 1 scrap is immaterial to most traders, they don't think twice about spending or losing it. A reclaimed is a more serious amount to lose for most people, so they are more hesitant to buy or sell keys at all.
I want you to understand how frustrating it is to be offering a better way to do the same thing, and have people so insistent that they want the bad way more.
Also, you set out to find counter proof. What did you expect to find?
Pants. People like to find pants. But they're hard to find, y'know?
Not everyone wants to sell every single key in their BP, they like to keep a bunch of keys for something else
could be a cushon incase they keep rising OR crash, either way.
Let's all just admit that the current key market is unstable, Upvoted
I'd not characterize it as unstable; It's quite stable, really. Just has a strong upward trend. Unstable would mean it's wildly fluctuating, up AND down, not just up.
Lets just admit, these keys are going to crash the tf2 economy in a year. You guys are paying to much for a "exceedingly rare hat". Come on! Its a virtual hat.
man shoo, I went to go buy a fedora today, and it was 300+$ (for a really nice brand name one granted)
I was messing around, changed my stance to downvote
upvoted as i know that personally keys i try to sell at 3.66 are not bought within days. but between 3.33 and 3.55 they sell easily
shhh, don't say that, you'll alert the dogs that claim they sell like free cake!
i dont understand why anyone would pay 3.66 for one as they are incredibly easy to find at 3.55
Thats the thing aint it, some people claim they sell like 20 and 30 keys at 3.66 but wheres the metal? any ways, last few people that mentioned they are hard sellers, got downvoted/flamed into hell and back, idk why lol...Idk why
Agreed, the outrageous flow of selling at 3.55/3.66 and buying at 3.33 spam that has flooded the market is because of this ridiculous range. Most sales do not happen at 3.33, instead around 3.44 and 3.55.
Upvoted.
http://www.tf2outpost.com/trade/8174532
Maybe I'm just unlucky, but I wanted some metal at the time, so I decided to try and sell 4 keys at the highest range of 3.66 for 6 days, with no bites. In the end I ended up selling 2 for 3.55 each, from a search of the buyers trades.
However, I don't know whether those people buying at 3.33 or less have any success, if finance says keys are 3.5, then wouldn't sales of 3.33 counteract the rise that the 3.55 sales have, making 3.44-3.5 the middleground?
Neutral for now.
[Ps : #110 most accurate Yay]
Means only that u are a coward. You dont vote on anything without a sure outcome. You have nothing to be proud of. Vote based on evidence or lack thereof or on how your gut tells you. Staying neutral because the outcome is uncertain just shows ur not some pricing guru, just someone that tries to boost thier stats.
Completely agree. The range right now is terrible.
downvote, ive recently bought 6+ keys at 3.33
bought 10 keys for 3.33 each in trade servers, only in outpost people are selling keys for 3.66 and only desperate people buy for that price, but i dont agree with the range 3.44.3.55, most accurate is 3.33.3.55 imo
too bad soome people refuse to accept that :|
Because it wasn't accurate.
3.33-3.55 is where trades occour. sadly downvote.
3.53 ref now. Uh....
http://tf2finance.com - 3.53
I keep hearing how people can sell keys for 3.66 slowly and buy keys for 3.33 slowly making the current suggestion accurate. It's a large range but correct.
Downvote
downvote. ive idled on trade servers long enough to know that everyones selling at 3.66
just wondering, how is it "idling" when you are there :
wtf are you doing? keys need a range. if the tf2finance is 3.5, than the range would be 3.33-3.66, not 3.5 or 3.44-3.55, provide real proof that they dont sell at 3.33 or 3.66, you claim you dont need proof, but for key price changes, you need at least 10 links of proof, PROOF, not speculation.
Spent 3 minutes exactly on outpost just hitting f5 on the front page. I could have bought any of the following:
3.55
http://www.tf2outpost.com/trade/8234473
http://www.tf2outpost.com/trade/8307645
http://www.tf2outpost.com/trade/8347984
http://www.tf2outpost.com/trade/8132322
http://www.tf2outpost.com/trade/8304001
http://www.tf2outpost.com/trade/8334878
http://www.tf2outpost.com/trade/8312879
3.66
http://www.tf2outpost.com/trade/8304100: A good thing to note is that serious and trustworthy traders tend to not put fake running counters on how they've sold 300 keys at the price when their backpacks aren't even worth 8 keys.
When traders are serious and successful with key sales, they tend to not make up loads of BS about their success. It's a not too subtle manipulation technique to make you believe that you are a member of a crowd.
*buys the 3.66 because backpack says so*
Next day 3.66-3.77 has become impossible to buy even at 3.66!
Only 2 of my 3.55 links are sold out right now. Which means that either 3.55 isn't crazy low even for Outpost, or that they are easily able to restock at 3.44. Both go to prove my range.
I approve of this suggested range , because , if keys keep rising , the bubble will burst and they will take a nose dive. So I'm contributing to the price rise to only see it fall soon enough.
Keep rising the price and be prepared for the dive. Upvote for lulz.
Sometimes I want to punch these highballers in the face.
"OH LOOK, I SOLD 1 KEY FOR 3.66, DOWNVOTED!@!@!@!@!@!@"
If I ever get around to selling keys, I'd be selling them at 2.33 ref EACH. I remember when they were at this price, and it was fair at the time (IN MY OPINION), and I also feel very comfortable with this price. I never thought keys would inflate as high as the price of 3+ craft hats... Upvote.
Even though I agree, you wouldn't be selling them for 2.33 while others can quickly sell them for 3.44+. This won't make any change to their price aswell, unfortunately.
I think that 3.33 ref is a outdated price, but i don´t think that 3.44-3.55 would be a better range. I think the perfect range now is 3.44 - 3.66 ref. Neutral vote