Suggestion: Mann Co. Supply Crate Key at 3.77–4 ref

No responsibility for the people who runs this site, they just wash their hands to the mess they let others create. All economies have rules to govern the flow and pace of goods sold and traded, to create stability and fairness for both the buyer and seller, something this site is clueless about. No rules, no respect.

Except backpack.tf is a third-party observer, not a government.backpack.tf has no control over the key supply nor does it have the funds (metal) necessary to subsidize key prices.

What exactly do you think backpack.tf should do? Its already been up multiple times to cap key price, but that isn't going to affect key traders all that much since it is obvious they already sell above current range successfully. The community at large would be glad to listen to your proposed solution to this issue.

has been suggested 9001 times. Might as well stop pricing bills, and buds, and ref to USD!

Long just leave it. If you raise the price again sellers will raise the price and buyers will invest more because they can sell for more. It's a never ending game...

He's not raising the price. He's reporting the current price.

And by effect, raising the price.

(Note to self: do not argue on the internet.)

A strange game. The only winning move is not to play.

I'm sure he's aware of it.

then the price should contininously be raised until the buyers STOP BUYING. then the price will go down. Demand for keys is up, price goes up. Its that simple.

Now for outpost to start selling keys for 4.11 then it will be 4-4.11 then it will keep on going

how are you gaining this many keys in such short periods of time and not only that you buying them for 3.77 and if you buy them so easily then why does it need to rise i mean it looks to me like you buy them at a rate that most people who play the game cant even imagine.

http://www.tf2outpost.com/trade/8861059

there is something fishy going on here that rate your bacpack is growing is insane in fact i think maybe 6 days ago i looked at it and it had only 300 keys now its double and still growing.

I had 200 back then but that was because I had around 20 earbuds after I sold a cauldron beak. I then sold those 20 earbuds for keys.

why do you want the keys so badly why not just keep the buds?

this time of the month last year, buds dropped from 26 to 19. I am out.

Thanks god i have 30 keys. Anyways, seems legit to me

um your 4.11 sellers didnt sell at 4, i would change that cause ur trade can get closed from false proof

Very hard to get under 4 ref these days, good proof, up vote.

so this day has come, oh boy XD

PUBLIC-SERVICE-ANNOUNCEMENT

STOP THE SPAM

It make the Mods jobs harder and it makes it harder to look at proof/counter proof...

So don't do it

For more info--> http://forums.backpack.tf/index.php?/topic/128-psastop-the-spam/

Since this suggestion WILL shift the price up to the high edge, you can only use finance as evidence if it actually says 4 ref. Btw have fun with those fifty bucks.

Lot of people are selling for 3.88 isn't time for 4 ref

please send those sellers my way...

i can barely get 3 a day @ 3.88

http://www.tf2outpost.com/trade/8982570 please don't dislike my comment, go buy all the keys

i disliked your comment for 2 reasons...

#1, you showed noone actually selling for 3.88

#2, I dislike comments which don't contribute anything to the suggestion... (i.e. spam, and since you have no proof to back up your claim, its just an opinion and therefore meaningless)

ever wonder why you comments are downvoted, you just talk about your opinion most of the time. but go ahead and complain that people downvote you because your right

his comments are being downvoted because he speaks the truth but no one on here want to listen to the truth so they downvote him in hope of other people won't see his comment and starting to think like him.

All key suggestions form a circlejerk group in it.

your suggestion is the reason there is a circle jerk and no, i down vote his comments such as:

"And frankly, noone cares if you can afford keys..."

Easy to buy at 3.66-3.77?

"Haha, aren't you funny..."

-gotta love the truth he is speaking there right?

Went on trade servers today and tried to buy keys, i was buying at 3.77 and didn't get a single one all day...

Enough with this "Trade servers are selling cheaper" nonsense."

-why isnt he required to show proof, he always wants people to prove things yet he says its impossible to buy from trade servers when plenty of other people say they can buy from trade servers. so everyone else is wrong except him?

"please send those sellers my way..."

"i can barely get 3 a day @ 3.88"

-does saying this really help the suggestion?

"u mad bra?"

-he speaks the truth right?

"Ya, hes doing this because he really wants that $12 profit...."

he has a forum page talking against spam yet isnt sarcasm like spam?

does acting sarcastic really help the mods make a decision?

does it really help this suggestion?

"Yes, actually i have

Ok, feel free to sell me all 61 of your keys for 3.88 each then."

-again, unnecessary arguing that gets this suggestion no where

"And frankly, noone cares if you can afford keys..."

Disproving his 1 and only reason as to y keys should stop rising.

"Went on trade servers today and tried to buy keys, i was buying at 3.77 and didn't get a single one all day...

Enough with this "Trade servers are selling cheaper" nonsense.""

Showing they can't be bought, and id be more than happy to show proof of my trade history and hours logged on tf2 in the past 2 weeks.

""i can barely get 3 a day @ 3.88""

Again, showing that 4 ref should b in the range, and id be more than happy to take a ss of my trade history.

"Ya, hes doing this because he really wants that $12 profit...."

Once again, proving an argument against the suggestion invalid.

"Yes, actually i have

Ok, feel free to sell me all 61 of your keys for 3.88 each then."

Proving that 3.88 is damn near impossible and id likely buy everyone i can get..

(And surprise surprise he declined bc he knows he can get 4 ref easily).

http://www.tf2outpost.com/trade/8987301 3.88

Ooooo, 1 whole person selling at 3.88 whos going to be sold out the second he comes online.... (Never knew 1 qualified as lots, well that being said, Sold LOTS of keys 1:1 for clean tc's, time to lower the tc's price).

Well, that definitley outweighs the tons and tons of trades SUCCESSFULLY selling at 4.

Market is flooded at Sellers for 4 ref IM downvoting

and most are quite successful...

So you're downvoting because they're are TONS of successful sellers at 4 ref...

Well that makes perfect sense......

they are successful but they are also a bunch of fucking dicks. we all know the trick, every time that a new price for keys comes out they are adding 1 or 2 scraps........ yeah, makes perfect sense to agree with the price for a bunch of dicks.

Awesome, in the past week I've bought 10+ keys from Scrap.TF.

With the new buying price, they actually get sellers faster.

Occassionally they have keys.

scrap.tf almost never has keys....

buying at 3.77 is impossible (trust me i've tried), and 3.88 is barely possible.

You must not be checking scrap.tf often enough, or I'm really lucky. If you wait ~5 minutes, there will usually be a seller there. 3.77 is pretty hard, though.

you are making me sad :(

It has begun.... Im afraid the OP is right.

The end is nigh.

Now it is already impossible to buy for my keys, as my dropp is awful and up almost every day the price of keys. Since this situation is tiresome and apparently no one does anything to stop this disproportionate rise in prices of the keys, as if approved, will come back the type of the keys to getting another suggestion price increase, we must stop this NOW.

keys raise in price because buyers are willing to pay...

And frankly, noone cares if you can afford keys...

What is with this constant desire of yours to update key prices the moment tf2finance reads that the average selling price for an hour is higher?

Easy, he is hoarding them, and know that with is rep it's easier to manipulate the market and raise his bp with ease. As I think that they possible go to 4 ref, earlier we change, earlier they go for 4.11. Another thing, if he are sure that keys go higher, he should not worried about and wait till someone does the suggest, 'cause a guy making a suggestion with more than +600 it's always suspicious... If he really doesn't want to raise his bp, wait till another make it...

Okay, do you think bp.tf rep really means anything in the trade economy? Do you think people will be like "Hmm... I didn't trust this guy at first, but he has quite a bit of rep built up on backpack.tf"

And if you're really that bent-out-of-shape from keys raising in prices, you can do one of two things:

1) Deal with it

2) Stop trading. You don't need to be a serious trader to enjoy TF2.

Personally, I stopped trading items that have prices in metal and only trade items that have key prices in them. Reason being because of the sporadic key prices, but because of this, I never really care for the increase in key prices.

The rep is only good to change prices here, a blue star next to your name gives you more credebility, don't think otherwise... The rep I was saying it's not about trading.

I'm not complaining about raise of tf2 keys, 'cause it's inevitable when Valve puts the upgrade to premium gift in store. But "wanting" the raise of prices keys is completely different. Because some guys really seems to be desperate to raise the keys... And that's a kind of scam that are new to tf2!

People here do not immediately upvote suggestions made by people with Blue Stars or higher ranks. If they did, the state of the prices would be much worse and the admins would be doing a poor job of checking the validity of prices (because admins check to see if a suggestion is accurate before closing. Why do you think some key suggestions have negative scores, but still pass?)

What do you think Long would gain from raising the price of keys by one scrap? Do you think he's trying to manipulate the key prices slowly so he can sell his keys for a million refined then crash the keys to buy keys at 2 ref each?

Hey I only can say that you are a bit naive. Of course, a higher rank help. I don't say it's automatic, but it really helps giving the upvotes.

Other thing, a really good burglar always make a good history to look good well in front of people. I'm not saying that he is. But all that rep to make now suggestions on keys, when he have more than 600, you need to agree with me that at least it look suspicious. If he is so sure that's a good suggestion why not waiting till someone else make it and not pass trough this type of attack on his credibility. If he doesn't have second intentions on this suggestion, he should close it and wait till another guys w/o keys make it, that way, his name passes clean. With this kind of small things the guy of spreasheet lose all of his credibility.

He gains a lot every time they go up LOL.

TL;DR: I'm not putting in cause the credibility of Long, but if he really doesn't have 2nd intentions he shouldn't made this type of suggestions... That's what i think.

So if I read that right, you can't make a suggestion for an item if you own it and you think your suggested range is correct because you obviously are just trying to manipulate the market.

Can you prove that he has hidden intentions for raising key prices? Don't speculate either, prove it.

Raise his backpack value?? Keys are still the same price in money. You can still buy them for the same cash amount as you always have. Sure his backpack will be worth more refined, but who cares about that? He's doing this to reflect what the market sells at. You people need to stop bashing him for "raising his bp", because raising the price of keys doesn't do that.

in terms of refined, yes it does. That is where the value rise comes in

Someone has a lot of keys on his bp...

Ya, hes doing this because he really wants that $12 profit....

$17, if im correct.

Profit is profit and he didn't start at this price, he started long ago at a MUCH lower price, raising it every week he can. Once a scammer always a scammer.

too bad I'm not a scammer. sorry bro.

if I was a scammer I would have a scammer tag and not another tag.

Long, people use the word "scammer" like sprinkles now a-days. Nobody even know what "scammer" even means at this point.

Yup.

I got called a scammer because I expected overpay in unusuals.

i was called a scammer because i wanted to profit. Not my fault people dont know prices. Scamming is intentionally asking for more than an items worth to the point that it is almost 50% more than the itms actual price.

Want the truth? This economy runs on sharks and scamming. Its not wrong; its called "business". I would say is bad ethics but its a game so.....

I once was called a scammer because I rejected someone's crappy offer for something.

How did you get to $12 and $17?

4ref - 3.88ref = 0.22ref = 2scrap

2scrap * 627 = 1254scrap =~ 139ref

139ref * $0.37/ref = $51,43

Um, 4 ref - 3.88 ref = 0.11 ref = 1 scrap.

That is a major error in your calculations.

upvote because it raises my bp value

Go fuck yourself you little shit,

I love you too

I hope you are trolling :D

i want my bp value to increase please admin accpt dis ))

Such profanity!

iz bad troll again

the key needs to stop raising -.-'

We all know that each time a suggestion gets cancelled they will make another one until it gets accepted. If it gets accepted they will get another one in less than 24 hours where they raise the range 1 scrap.

This is outrageous.

when will this stop, i still keep on buying at 3.77

Jesus chirst, Someone need to make a rule that you can only price suggest once a month for an items

unsold 4 ref : http://www.tf2outpost.com/trade/8975593

http://www.tf2outpost.com/trade/8926623

http://www.tf2outpost.com/trade/8986603 stock 50+

http://www.tf2outpost.com/trade/8846644 stock 28

http://www.tf2outpost.com/trade/8966135

http://www.tf2outpost.com/trade/8814020

http://www.tf2outpost.com/trade/8986355

http://www.tf2outpost.com/trade/8903007

http://www.tf2outpost.com/trade/8894183

http://www.tf2outpost.com/trade/8970346

http://www.tf2outpost.com/trade/8987174

http://www.tf2outpost.com/trade/8983220

http://www.tf2outpost.com/trade/8971853

http://www.tf2outpost.com/trade/8230536

http://www.tf2outpost.com/trade/8985155

http://www.tf2outpost.com/trade/8986038

http://www.tf2outpost.com/trade/8975895

http://www.tf2outpost.com/trade/8868802

http://www.tf2outpost.com/trade/8950296

http://www.tf2outpost.com/trade/8964318

http://www.tf2outpost.com/trade/8910707

http://www.tf2outpost.com/trade/8949986

http://www.tf2outpost.com/trade/8827589

http://www.tf2outpost.com/trade/8944665 3.88

http://www.tf2outpost.com/trade/8936474

http://www.tf2outpost.com/trade/8953792

http://www.tf2outpost.com/trade/8957801

http://www.tf2outpost.com/trade/8990164 - 3.77!

http://www.tf2outpost.com/trade/8990707 - 3.77! probably will sell

ill modify this everytime with more links

man, is very good downvote a key suggestion

you're downvoting because you found 14 unsucessful sellers....

You do realize that there are 200 new selling trades every 5 minutes....

They're are bound to be a bunch that are unsold.

long have 20 links at 4 ref, i have more and this is not my suggestion, and ' u said' theres 200 sellers every 5 minutes, why did he have only 20?

hmmm 20 links which are regularly bumped, which have sold a bunch.... vs. 14 which are rarely bumped....

Look how many 3.88 buyers he found....if there are sooo many people willing to pay 3.88 then do you honestly think that there not successful at selling for 4?

HAHAHAH A BUNCH? DID U LOOKED THE LINKS?

Yes, actually i have

Ok, feel free to sell me all 61 of your keys for 3.88 each then.

No, this is not a trade server dude, and u saw that for sale? no

Haha of course you wouldn't sell them for 3.88 since you KNOW that you can easily get 4 ref....

http://www.tf2outpost.com/trade/8230536 up for one month and change price. he sell more than 1 key..

http://www.tf2outpost.com/trade/8944665 bump one day ago. meaning he is out of stock or just not online

http://www.tf2outpost.com/trade/8868802 sold a lot that he have to restock

http://www.tf2outpost.com/trade/8964318 how do you know he didn't sell any

http://www.tf2outpost.com/trade/8910707 bump 1 day ago.

http://www.tf2outpost.com/trade/8949986 bump 1 day ago

http://www.tf2outpost.com/trade/8827589 bump 1 day ago

http://www.tf2outpost.com/trade/8936474 bump 1 day ago

http://www.tf2outpost.com/trade/8953792 bump 1 day ago

More than half of your proof is trades that never get bumped to get visitors.

why i cant modify anymore? okay i have more

http://www.tf2outpost.com/trade/8948699

http://www.tf2outpost.com/trade/8925078

http://www.tf2outpost.com/trade/8991488 selling for 3.88

http://www.tf2outpost.com/trade/8991478 3.88 too

http://www.tf2outpost.com/trade/8991587 3.88

http://www.tf2outpost.com/trade/8989331

1st link has add. second link sold at 3.88 before on another trade.

3rd link has add

4th link just sold one

all 3.88´s has adds, when everyone is selling for 4 ref, 1 scrap makes all the difference and read link 1 'added me' ' no u havent'

I thought you weren't commenting.

Oh and I need say, when keys are 2.55 ~ 2.66 market was flooded with 2.55 buyers and 2.66 Sellers, long, understand one thing, people NEVER will sell for the lower range,yeah go ahead and make more suggestions ,for keys, this will have no end

now i know who is the responsible of the massive keys inflation.

Its you!!! thanks for raping the tf2 economy

Look!! You have more keys .. lol (just kidding)

anyway, the previous suggestion about raising up the key price just got closed hours ago.

Give it a rest for a few days or maybe a week. It needs some balance. And it seems pretty stable at 3.87 on TF2Finance [url]http://tf2finance.com/keys/[/url]

Dont get fooled by outpost highballers!! Be smarter than them, mate :D

"owns - 627" HOLY F!@# Nice lol!

Another key suggestion? D:

oh god stop this madness

* 6 months later* New suggestion : 8 refined

I can see that happening...

I think I'll stay neutral on this one, It's like a war zone here.

This is where all the fun starts.

Long, you don't need to be the one to suggest.

Who else would you expect? But honestly, if I were him, I'd rather not have my name trampled upon for rep. Someone else would have suggested this anyways.

Keys went up in price by 0.33+ in just 2 weeks. http://global3.memecdn.com/Its-happening_o_129980.gif

Added a guy selling 2 keys for 3.88 on outpost

He went insane at the amazing amount of adds in 2 minutes . Luckily I added him first .

I also sold 2 keys for 4 ref each in a trade server .

As much as I hate this inflation , it deserves an upvote.

Regardless of what people think of the keyconomy inflation, this is good evidence of a necessary update. Upvoted.

i tought try-harders only existed for people who were bat at the game, now i see that it actually exist on trades, for people who is bad on coming up with a correct price for items

"i tought try-harders only existed for people who were bat at the game, now i see that it actually exist on trades, for people who is bad on coming up with a correct price for items"

what are you trying to say man ?

Try hard definition:

an individual who will try very hard to be good at something and eventually fails, and keep doing it.

on the last month, last week, whatever, ( not 100% sure about it), you tried lot of time to change key price, without success, tons of sugestions closed, basically spaming. Chill the fuck out of increasing key price every 10 seconds. Market WILL BREAK, that's a fact. There's no way back, the only thing we can do is postpone it.. Key will be so expensive that no one will buy it, therefore every other item will change hard on price, and also break

Think long term before changin key price. Trying to change it so much in so short time is like change dollar value ( extreme example, but if you're racional you'll understand), it will break if you're not thinking both long-short term. Is that so hard to do it?

I made a total of 5 keys suggestions(excluding this one) and 3 of which got passed. spamming ? I don't think so. and http://backpack.tf/vote/id/512e808c4bd7b8947a00000a took my proof and get passed.

10 days and 3 changes? show me how thats correct

because people are willing to pay more for keys according to tf2finance and proofs ?

because prople are dumb enough to buy keys from whoever offers him first, without any real search?

Paying 3.7~4 ref on a key is bullshit, 5~7 min doing some research you can buy them at 3.6~3.7

go buy keys at 3.6 for me please. if you think "doing some research" can get you keys cheap then you are crazy. a lot of people are out there hunting cheap keys too and the chance of you getting one is extremly rare.

idk why i cant answear to you comment, but

"" if you think "doing some research" can get you keys cheap then you are crazy""

ok, i've read enough bullshit for a lifetime, ill go kill myself, if you want you can keep my backpack

Doing research WILL get me cheaper things. Event if this is a virtual market, life trading rules STILL APLLIES. If you want something cheap, search a little bit and you find, this isnt rocket science

how is this price bad?

keys are almost impossible to buy for less than 3.88 and even 3.88 is a bit hard. And they easily sell for 4 ref....In the past 5 days i've bought about 30 keys at 3.88, and sold about 70....

did i said that the price is bad?

i tought try-harders only existed for people who were bat at the game, now i see that it actually exist on trades, for people who is bad on coming up with a correct price for items

^^implies you think this is a bad price.

is not the price that is wrong, all this bullshit with keys is just plain dumb, and whoever agree with this bullshit is also wrong, but what can i do, if people are dumb enough to buy key for 3.7+....

also, keys are not impossible to buy less than 3.8, if you actually play the game you can see that trade servers exist, and you can buy keys at 3.6~3.7 easily

( trading on tf2 doesnt go around only of tf2op)

Most trading does occur via OP, and i do go on servers, and i've yet to buy a single key for less than 3.88

Bullshit, on my first trade server I wanted to buy one key at 3.77 and got one instantly.

ya, you're right, i'm lying........

You got lucky...simple as that, Also, you bought 1 whole key...damn.....better make the range 3.77 flat.

We should make the key cost only 4ref not more not less

It would prevent from making it higher

"It would prevent from making it higher"

The irony

next people start selling 4.11 neverending story.., im tired of this shit, daily key vote,price manipulators , proofs based in outpost, and people with 600 keys in their bp suggest new prices every fucking day..for me bp.tf lost their credibility in respect of key price..key price raise 1 scrap every day because of this damn votes..how the fuck is possible? 1 scrap every day, tell me now is because of idle accounts and bla bla, bp.tf is the only guilty

bp.tf isn't who you should be blaming...

Key prices would rise with or without bp.tf

What happens:

people buy keys at 3.66 Refined, they each try to sell at 3.77 (at some point they will get a sale), onlookers will see 3.77 being successful, and start buying at 3.66, now you have 100 buyers at 3.66....Which leads someone to buy at 3.77 (so they actually have a decent shot at getting keys), and the cycle repeats....

So the one to blame are the buyers who are willing to pay these key prices..... bp.tf might be speeding the process along, but it would happen with or without bp.tf

bullshit, people use bp.tf with reference and they are willing too pay 1 more scrap of original price because in their minds is just 1 scrap and this neverending story, keys are rising 1 scrap every day, how is possible? because of bp.tf and their key sugestion every day but some people are enjoying this shit because the value of their bp go up and maybe a lots of people start quitting tf2 and this awesome user can buy their bp with keys ^^ i see lot of people start quitting tf2 because of this shit

But wait he suggest a lot of item price but why in their post in OP he dont use bp.tf with reference

buying

http://www.tf2outpost.com/trade/7507266 --> dont use bp.tf price

http://www.tf2outpost.com/trade/8702774 --> same

http://www.tf2outpost.com/trade/7721351 same

and so on

its little funny one amazing expert price dont use bp,tf with reference, oh wait is only quicksell :D

ridiculous, is damn irony

is my last comment here about this user and key prices

enjoy ur greedy

I use backpack.tf as prefenrence when I sell stuff.

Anyone has the right to offer whatever the price they want on their buy trades.

Just because I'm the #1 on here make me have to follow the prices on this site all the time ? No thank you.

Why don't you use backpack.tf as preference, http://puu.sh/2b37M http://puu.sh/2b386

enjoy ur greedy, hypocrite

because like i said above, and so many times, Outpost dont have any rule about prices, so cant be proof but people continue use outpost for their proofs, i can put one craft hat for 17 keys, noone cares i can buy one bills for 1 key noone cares, outpost is free market, thanks for give me reason :)

oh and is better u start use ur own links when u put other price sugestion mr price expert

just lock the fucking price of keys at 4 ref and get it over with

scrap.tf sells for 4 ref. Holy **** when will this bubble break?

When I TELL IT TO BREAK

This made me fucking laugh

Hey long, I hope you read this, you asshole. If you hadn't forced the price to rise the last three times, people on outpost.tf wouldn't be asking for 3.88-4 ref for keys, they would be asking for 3.66-3.77 at most. all they do is choose the highest price offered (if keys are set to 3.77-3.88, everyone will sell at 3.88). some people even raise their price up a scrap to gain profit. NOBODY WILL LOWER THERES. If you raise the official price on here constantly, they will keep raising what they want for theirs. Long, you fucking asshole, you have 600+ keys in your backpack and you're constantly going to be raising the price and watching people on outpost want even more. For real. anyone who is upvoting his suggestions is a complete tool who has no idea what he is doing.

When this passes, I bet a million dollars you make a new one set at "3.88-4 ref", then after that, "3.88-4.11 ref" then "4-4.11" and so on.

Also, each time you will magicaly have dozens of more keys that the time before, even though you claim not to be doing this for your own profit.

You are crashing the tf2 economy and fucking everyone over for your own gain.

please get banned from backpack.tf

u mad bra?

He's mad. :P

I'm sorry for reflecting the correct price base on the market and tf2finance.

right...

I'm right you know.

You, long, also know that if we just left the price at 3.66-3.77 and didnt change it, nobody would be asking for 4 ref for them

Thats not even close to true....

"Key prices would rise with or without bp.tf

What happens:

So the one to blame are the buyers who are willing to pay these key prices..... bp.tf might be speeding the process along, but it would happen with or without bp.tf"

Well think about it, long had 200 keys just days ago, then raised the price a couple times, then cashed out his buds and crap for 500+ keys, raised price again and now has 600+ keys and is trying to raise it again (lol, and we all know hes going to have pushed it to at least 4.33 and have 700+ keys within the next week or two).

I agree that key prices would still rise without backpack.tf, but the overall price of the key (probably the most used currency) has doubled value over a couple months is just a tad bit silly, is it not?

The thing i find ridiculous is that somone had the nerve to even raise price on CURRENCY. Currency should not move. It needs to be set so that there is a stable economy.

In previous times it was:

2.66=1 key

8 keys = 1 bill

25 keys = 1 bud

2 buds= 1 max

These are currency. They should hardly move at all. If we can really call this game an economy, then keys really should never move. If you dont want to call this a currency, then thatsreally stupid because we all know keys are currency.

#1, Keys used to be 2 ref for the longest time, and prior to that they were 1 ref for the longest time...... This isn't the first time keys have changed value....

#2, Really? currencies never change??? Do i need to show you a conversion chart between USD, British Pound, Euro, etc... Currencies no question change.... O, And don't forget Buds, buds were pretty stable at 13 keys (October 2011), and then they slowly started creeping up until they reached 27 keys (around april 2012), at which point they crashed down to 18~ keys....

Currencies Change... You can't deny that...

Also, Keys aren't really changing, its Ref thats changing. Keys have been stable for quite some time at $1.20-$1.30, rather its the Ref $-value which is decreasing forcing the price of keys in Ref to increase....

def. of mad right here

I see a lot of buys at 3.88 but not so many 4. Seems to unrealistic/desperate of a max value; I can still get keys at 3.77 without much hassle.

That's why 3.77 is in the range..

I didn't say it wasn't. I said 4 was too high.

That's why you can sell Keys for 4 Ref :o

It's like you didn't even read what I posted...

Am I late to the butthurt comments?

http://i.imgur.com/O1zDJ.gif

Edit: still downvoting

the guy in that gif is a boss enough said

Fuck it. I'm going to a store, getting on my knees in the middle of the store and reciting.

"The day has come! The prophecy has come true. God help us all.." :p

lol, it's have to be fun sitting on outpost 5 hours or more every day and making new suggestion for keys =D

We all knew this day would come. The day keys... hit 4 refined.

backpack.tf should seriously have a regular price and an outpost price. outpost prices are always 2 scrap larger for sellers, and 2 scrap less for buyers. Wouldnt that be perfect?

http://scrap.tf/keys

Current Buy Price: 4 refined

If key price wasn't updated every 5 days they wouldn't rise in price this fast...

Actually it takes 1-2 days for a new suggestion to get opened.

bull. easy 2 buy @3.77 or 3.66 on trade servers

Nice proof.

whatever. outpost is full of highball sellers and lowball buyers

Easy to buy at 3.66-3.77?

Haha, aren't you funny...

Went on trade servers today and tried to buy keys, i was buying at 3.77 and didn't get a single one all day...

Enough with this "Trade servers are selling cheaper" nonsense.

enough with this "trade servers are selling cheaper nonsense"

haha arent you funny...

went on trade trade servers today and bought 3 keys at 3.77

Oh boy, look who's raising key prices again.

The General Feel of the People in This Suggestion, In a Nutshell: "The price of keys is too damn high!"

It's not anybody's fault you can't afford keys anymore other than your own. You don't bitch when a newspaper releases news, so quit bitching when Long posts the current prices.

he isn't posting current prices. he's raising it to have it raised again

see his post from 10 days ago

"Hi guys, i have over 200 keys and want to raise my backpack value"

look at his keys now, he's trying to make profit, not change the price to "Current"

scrap.tf is paying 4 ref for keys

UPVOTED!

3.77 actually, it sells at 4.

Selling at 3.88 AKA WITHIN CURRENT RANGE

http://www.tf2outpost.com/trade/9000636

http://www.tf2outpost.com/trade/8894721 - Was selling for 3.88 until today

Unsuccessful 4 ref:

http://www.tf2outpost.com/trade/8985822

http://www.tf2outpost.com/trade/8987174

http://www.tf2outpost.com/trade/8997376

http://www.tf2outpost.com/trade/8979956

http://www.tf2outpost.com/trade/8952597

http://www.tf2outpost.com/trade/8983368 Yes yes, nice "sold" counter with no posts.

http://www.tf2outpost.com/trade/8940753

http://www.tf2outpost.com/trade/8957801

http://www.tf2outpost.com/trade/8990993

http://www.tf2outpost.com/trade/8822716

People add your proof. Use trade servers, bazaar, whatever you need.

To make this suggestion invalid, you can show that people are having trouble selling for 4 refined.

Here's me selling 7 keys for 3.77 each because I'm not a douchebag and practice what I preach:

http://gyazo.com/9abdbc28436152974fbd948ce1bec69f

Was selling at 3.88 but sold out:http://www.tf2outpost.com/trade/8991929

AKA WILLING SELLER WITHIN CURRENT RANGE.

http://www.tf2outpost.com/trade/9004499 Selling for 3.88

http://www.tf2outpost.com/trade/8999641 - Was selling at 3.66 His avatar fits his personality :P

http://www.tf2outpost.com/trade/8964002

http://www.tf2outpost.com/trade/9001111

http://www.tf2outpost.com/trade/8998067

http://www.tf2outpost.com/trade/8984378

http://www.tf2outpost.com/trade/8966135

http://www.tf2outpost.com/trade/8895921

http://www.tf2outpost.com/trade/8957801

http://www.tf2outpost.com/trade/8993592

http://www.tf2outpost.com/trade/8994736

http://www.tf2outpost.com/trade/8811811

http://www.tf2outpost.com/trade/8847169

http://www.tf2outpost.com/trade/8110683 - no recent adds

http://www.tf2outpost.com/trade/8436527 - no recent adds

http://www.tf2outpost.com/trade/8991253

http://www.tf2outpost.com/trade/8953329

http://bazaar.tf/trade/145396

http://bazaar.tf/trade/147051

http://bazaar.tf/trade/146250

http://bazaar.tf/trade/149532

http://bazaar.tf/trade/130423

TL;DR No

Most of your 4 Ref trades are not older than a day.

You realize the last suggestion is just over a day, right?

So that means these people raised their prices probably hours after the last one got suggested. The trades are new because the price is new.

It's simple. We stop buying keys for the suggested backpack.tf price AND we kill the Batman.

The longer the site denies that this site and outpost have no impact on the price hike, the worse the backlash will be when the TF2 community turns on this site

Funny how you own 627 keys.

bc someone whos worth 2000$ cares about $20~

like someone whos worth 2000$ cares about 1 scrap

profit=profit

no matter how BIG or SMALL

prof·it

/ˈpräfit/

Noun

A financial gain, esp. the difference between the amount earned and the amount spent in buying, operating, or producing something.

By the way in case anyone likes drama you can reread my comment over and over to simulate a conversation between concerned traders and Long.

HonestTrader1 "You keep suggesting new prices as soon as the other gets accepted, quoting TF2finance and highballoutpost"

Long: "You mean I'm actually trying to reflect prices..."

TL;DR - Long is a robot because he never does anything productive. He has one function - to raise key values and one response "I have rep. I reflect the market"

Edit: I think my grammar was too perfect to be one of Long's replies.

VoxDei is a robot. He is against new suggestions for keyprices but doesn't have any counter proof.

You responded to my counterproof.

See... my name is there and your name is there: http://gyazo.com/985c2b8a19b58c408ab2079af97cd75c

Pay attention before you just say things. It will help you not look like a fool

I just wanted to talk bullshit, too.

See where that gets you? Nowhere. At least I contributed counter proof as well as nonsense. More than I can say for you.

http://imgur.com/SD3mtF9

Upvote

If this goes to this price no one will sell for 3.77 everyone will just sell for 4 might as well make it 4 ref right on the dot

It's very to find anyone selling for less than 4 ref. I was able to buy 10 keys today for 3.77 ref and considered myself lucky that I found someone selling in bulk for that price. I've bought several keys today for 3.88 ref or 3.88 ref + 1 weapon.

I think the low end for key prices should be 3.88 ref instead of 3.77.

Screenshots: http://i.imgur.com/FDIZIgn.png http://i.imgur.com/Oj1WvT0.png

I retract what I said earlier that was seemingly in support of a price bump to 4 ref. I do not support a price change to 4 ref.

It seems the only way to get keys "cheaply" (read: not for 4 ref) is to make a listing stating that you are buying keys. I've had several people add me to sell keys for 3.77 and 3.88 ref. Looking through the list of sellers is a waste of your time if you don't want to pay the highball prices.

This price suggestion should not go through. Buyers just need to be patient.

ya know. I just cant help but laugh.

This really is sad. The price rising like this....ive never seen it before. No one thinks of the ramifications. However, i think now is the time to explain it. I know some of you may have read something like what i am about to say before but i will put this in a new light.

Problem 1: Backpack.tf's image

Backpack.tf is well known through most of the community. On this site, many traders come to check prices, see backpacks, and offer new suggestions. This is wonderful for the community and works most of the time. Now that this site is reliable and has a good reputation over other spreadsheets (mainly the one tf2 spreadsheet). However, this also comes at a certain price. Forced to always reflect the market, this site must be kept up-to-date as much as possible. The best way for that? Let the community do the voting then as we recieve the votes, we will determine the final say. Needless to say, this has worked in most cases. However, with the key, this is certainly NOT working. We need to find a price that WILL NOT MOVE. The key is currency for a reason. It should not be shifting like this. Back to the site. Due to this site being well known, people trust it for prices. However, not everyone has the time to upvote and downvote on this site, thus, not everyones input is put in. I am taking a stab at this but i assume there are about maybe 20k monthly users? maybe more. I dont know. But i guarantee you, they dont care for upvote and stuff. They just want the prices. Well, nothing wrong with that...except when the prices are coming off of Problem 2.

Problem 2: Proof

This is a major problem. Most proof is coming from tf2 outpost, a site well known for its highballers and lowballers. When this site is used as proof to raise or lower prices, we have to always remember one thing: TF2 OUTPOST IS NOT THE ONLY TRADING WEBSITE. Also, do we know what does on in servers? Many servers have trades selling at 3.66 still! However, we choose to look at a website that is well known for its "survival of the fittestest" idea. If this happens, then obviously prices will fall and rise like crazy. But more importantly, key prices.

Problem 3: Admins of this site

NO I AM NOT HATING ON ADMINS. The admins are trying to turn a profit no doubt, but they can fix this too. This site's prices are mirrored throughout all of TF2. If the admins just took a step without the crutch of these votes or proof, they could ultimately change things for the better. However, that is not what this site was built on. It was built on facts of OUTPOST. And thus, the admins say that they "cannot just simply change prices". They use this as their crutch.

Now that the problems are stated, Let us see the ramifications (and for those of younger age this means the effect of these problems)

Ramification of problem 1: The continuing rise of keys.

This one is often said and ill be brief. The rise of keys is because traders see this webesite and try to sell a scrap above backpack.tf's prices. Then people like Long and Simon try to raise the price out of "accuracy" (as a lack for a better excuse). The next ramification will talk about this.

Ramification of problem 2: Proof is becoming obselete

Thats right. Even with all the proof of OUTPOST, it is becoming increasing obselete. Why? becasue most (not all) voters are seeing the proof but know that the proof is from a sight of highballers. And once more, because they sell a scrap higher than backpack.tf, the cycle will begin again resulting in a new price range.

Ramification of problem 3: Loss in trust of admins

This site can almost be thought of as a popular vote. If an item deserves its price, it is upvoted. If there is sufficient proof for it to go down in price, it is upvoted. however, did most of you know? THE ADMINS HAVE FINAL SAY. PERIOD. If they like the price, they can overrule all votes and say that this price is good. Now, there is no proof that this is true, however, the past suggestions that have recieved sufficient negative votes STILL got accepted. Once again, the admins use the crutch of the site needing to be "up-to-date" and "reflects current prices" when we all know WHY the prices are the way they are. The cycle once again begins etc etc...

Now. The last part. How to fix this.

Fix 1: Sacrifice some dignity

Simple. JUST FORGET IT. The community of tf2 already suffers from this sites key price suggestions so now we must fix it. Let us get as many people as we can and discuss this once and for all: ONE PRICE TO RULE THEM ALL!

Fix 2: Suggesting key prices

Should someone try to move key prices again, make the way to suggest them harder. Perhaps:

-Proof from other websites

-Witnesses: people on servers who agree/disagree

-At least 1000 voters before being dec ded

-If outpost is use, they must use EVERY POST as evidence. Even if not buying at the price suggestion.

When these are implimented, i guarantee you people WILL stop suggesting so much. THIS IS FOR KEYS ONLY!

Fix 3: Admins, throw away the crutch AND MAKE THE CHANGES.

I know you have your rep of this site t maintain but now i really think the admins have lost more respect. True they only do their job, but because of that, they have thrown the economy into disarray. the admins must admit to this and find a way to set it right. If i could o it, i would just say: 3 ref. Period. No moving. Then everyone is happy.

This is a simple outline of what has happened, what should happen, and what will happen. I am not out to attack anyone. I am merely stating what has happened and what to do about it. Thanks for reading.

i lol'ed at the lord of the rings reference good job!

#1,

The change in key price is NOT the fault of Bp.tf, but rather that buyers are willing to pay what the sellers ask. Part of this comes from the supply, while the amount of keys in existence is higher than it was before halloween, how many of those keys are going towards the marketplace? Also, something else to keep in mind, more and more people play this game. More and more people realize how easy it is to profit on keys, so the number of people buying/selling keys has increased to an absurd amount (to the point where there are 400 new trades every 5 minutes either buying or selling keys). So there is a lot more competition now than there has ever been before.

#2,

OP isn't the only source used, but it is a crucial one. Most trading occurs through OP. Also, a key price has yet to be accepted if TF2finance.com didn't support the suggestion. (TF2finance tracks ALL key sales, including ones that take place on servers)

#3,

Thats not actually true, not all the admins are profit traders. Also, the admins do accept/reject suggestions against voters--but only if they can find a valid reason (and they will usually explain this reason right b4 accepting or rejecting the suggestion).

Fix #1,

Bp.tf keeping prices up-to-date is actually more beneficial than not keeping the price accurate for a very simple reason. The keys sellers (the ones that control the market) will continue to raise their prices no matter what bp.tf says, HOWEVER, by not updating prices, the newer trader will get preyed upon and end up selling their keys for 4 ref when everyone else is selling them for 4.66 ref, leading to larger profit margins for the key sellers allowing them to buy more keys and have an even more dominating affect on the market.

Fix #2,

What other website? Bazaar has almost no traffic, TP is just hell since you never know how many a person has actually sold. And SOP sells for mostly paypal. Screen shots of trades on servers are most certainly proof, but there is a lack of trades that occur on a server (so you would end up need a ton of people to get proof of only a handful of sales). And using every post would be absurd, every 5 minutes 200 new selling trades appear on OP, and the same goes for buying trades. Also, if one can find 30~ buyers at the low end and 30~ sellers at the high end, you can make the assumption that there are far more on OP doing the same.

I dont have time to debunk all theories so ill aim at crucial ones:

#2. Outpost has, what, 20k users per month? how many people play this game? You honestly cannot prove IMHO that MOST trades of TF2 come from outpost. The thought that a single site has MOST of the possible millions of trades going on. That is just simply ridiculous. Thus, it should not be the only source. Tf2 finance is a good place to keep track of keys but does that include private bps (honest quesion). Because if it doesnt, there is a MAJOR flaw in that.

Fix #1. The problem is that this site is already used as the guide BEFORE these prices thus the sellers FOLLOWED our prices but sold higher. Confusing i know but i cant really say it better.

Fix #2. Please remember why i ask that so much proof be used. KEEPS ARE CURRENCY! These should rarely move at all! a quarter is not worth a dollar the next day jsut because sellers say so. NO. It is currency and must not move from its set price. That is why i ask for harder proof. Do you really think outpost is that reliable?I will admit it is a good source but not always the best. There needs to be more proof in future suggestion.AND YES. I want them to be damn near impossible to move. Whoever wants to suggest a new price i want them to have to go through HELL and BACK before i let them assert their suggestion. I want them to practically waste hours upon hours of their time because you know what? I dont want them ruinng something that is working well. You dont mess with a currency and if you want to, you better be ready to walk through hell and back. You had better waste your time doing getting all the proof you can because that will show how truly determined you are to make a suggestion.

As a more direct challenge: I CHALLENGE YOU LONG TO SHOW ME THAT AT LEAST 75% OF THE COMMUNITY WANTS THESE NEW PRICES! You use outpost as a crutch for your suggestions. Show me witnesses, servers, photos, etc of peopel who REALLY want this to go through. Then we can start the real negotiations.

#2 OP has a lot more than 20k users a month.... There are just shy of 300,000 users that have logged in. Graned, there not all active, but theres most certainly far more than 20,000. And $-wise, OP trades accounts for more trades than server trades. Server trades have a higher number---tons of small trades (1 weapon-1 scrap trades), but $-wise, and key-wise OP out numbers server trades. TF2finance tracks key sales, has nothing to do with private bps (keep in mind odds are both buyer and seller dont have private bps).

Fix #1,

But what you don't realize is that bp.tf wasn't what caused this to happen. It might be speeding up the rise in price, but it is in no way creating it. (and IMO, keys will have to settle at some point, and the sooner that happens the better, so lets get to the absolute max asap).

Fix #2,

How can you say keys shouldn't move?? Do you really think keys should be 2.66 ref? And if bp.tf said they were 2.66 you would just end up with key buyers buying up all the 2.66 ref keys from noobs and you'd end up with the same market we have right now, except the sellers would now be making far more than 1 scrap profit per key. And OP is quite a reliable source....if i can find 30+ buyers willing to pay 3.88 Refined for an item, should that item really be any less?

Technically keys aren't going up...keys have been stable at $1.20-$1.30 for quite some time. Whats happening is metal is losing value. There are far more idle accounts than ever before injecting tons of ref into the market making it pretty much useless for anything other than buying craft hats/keys. Frankly, ref is pretty much useless, and noone really wants it. People use ref as a means to an end--to buy keys.

And noone wants keys to be 4 ref, hell, i'd love keys to be 2.33 ref again, but what we want doesn't matter....unless you can convince EVERY key buyer to go on strike, then what we want means absolutley nothing. As long as buyers are willing to pay what sellers are asking for the price will stay the same/rise.

Now at some point the supply will equal the demand the key prices will finally stabilize, but until that happens sellers will continue to ask for more, and buyers will continue to pay up.

I will never settle that 30+ traders got greedy and wanted more as "proof". We are a pillar of the community and what we say can affect a lot. IMHO i dont think your seeing that. What we do here will impact a large amount of the economy. Thus if we truly wish to change prices, I want people like long to not just go on whims whenever he feels like it to suggest a new price. NO. I. WILL. NOT. HAVE IT. And neither does the community at large want it.

My final words on this matter: If you want to change key prices, I better see a helluva lot more proof than "30+" traders on a site that has 300k+ users (albeit some not active) and is basically for selling high and buying super low in some cases. You better get me screenshots, statistics, tf2 finance, proof from other sites, witnesses, etc. I, and many people with me, need to see more proof that tf2 economy is ready to take such a bold step in practically CHANGING the currency. It should not be easy as suggesting and throwing proof.

Ok, so you're main argument against this suggestion is that there isn't enough proof.

So, Why don't you go find more proof refuting this suggestion.

Unfortunately, i think we have reached a point where what the proof says no longer matters. It is up to the community to choose its prices now. Long says he has enough proof. Then let the votes show it. However, the community is in an uproar right now. I would explain it but i really dont wanna see comments get sunk due to dislikes. If you truly wish to continue to engage in this battle of wits, i invite you to add me. Then we may continue on steam.

OMG

the increase will not stop?

what is the limit?

10 ref, 2o ref, 50 ref?

when that increase will end

id like to think the price of keys will stop when it reaches 2 keys. But who knows

Long218 10 days ago: "Hey guys, I have over 200 keys and I want to increase my backpack value." Note that he now owns 620 keys. Seems legit.

The accepted price 10 days ago was 3.66 to 3.77 ref. Now it seems like the price has increased 2 scrap since. At this rate, the price for a key will be 5 ref at the start of June.

This is why every time I see a new key price suggestion, I insta-downvote. I don't care how "wrong" or "incorrect" it is, this can't continue. The only people that profit from this are people with lots of keys.

What about.... "NO"

i upvote this, i have finally stopped being butthurt about key prices.

your litterally worse than gold on my dick. when there are 50000 keys on the market, you cant take 20 and raise the price. you own fucking 627. backpack.tf shouldnt be able to raise key prices, it should be completely based off of tf2finance. THE ONLY REASON THEY ROSE IS BECAUSE OF IDIOTS WHO SUPPORT INFLATION ON THIS SITE MANIPULATED IT TO BE SO. KEY PRICES ARE BASED OFF OF THE ITEMS YOU GET IN crates, HURDUR(stranges). GET OVER IT. THERE IS NO REASON FOR THEM TO BE WORTH THIS MUCH. STRANGES BARELY TOP 2 REF AT BEST. THERE IS ONLY REASON FOR DROP, NOT RAISE. THE LOW LOW CHANCE OF GETTING AN UNUSUAL BARELY RAISES THE PRICE, AND ALL UNUSUALS SLOWLY DROP ANYWAY.

u mad bra?

"STRANGES BARELY TOP 2 REF AT BEST"

--Hmmm...Ever heard of: Deadringer, Ambassador, Crate 30/40 stranges, Grenade Launcher, Mini gun, Degreaser, Eternal Reward, Shotgun, Flare gun, Reserve Shooter, Jarate, Sandman, black box, escape plan....

Also, tons of stranges are less than 1 reclaimed, so why not make keys 1 reclaimed? hmmm? Please....do explain this magical formula you've made up to determine the price of keys....

And FYI, keys have become a currency, and therefore there price is NOT dependent on crates.

P.S. you should really learn how the economy works (and how key prices are actually derived) before making blatantly wrong accusations.

We should just call it quits. Key=4 ref

Ref is a quarter. Key is a dollar bill (metaphorically, not actual price)

Ref is actually $0.35 and keys are $1.40. So the math works out perfectly actually if keys stay at 4 ref. If this is gonna get accepted we should just leave keys at 4 ref and not let them go any higher.

there are many sellers on SOP that sell at $1.35 or less.

Can someone ban this idiot? He is clearly doing this for his own gain (owns 627 keys). What a fucking imbecile. He clearly has no life and probably sits at home all day making new suggestions for keys since he seems to be able to do this shit every day. He is a low life scum. Oh and I am still able to buy keys at 3.66 ref so your suggestion is complete bullshit imo: http://www.tf2outpost.com/trade/8758202

maybe you should read the proof before you talk.

Maybe you should stop lying and include all of your proof before you talk dipshit. I have been able to successfully buy keys at 3.66 ref in the past few days and it's funny that it isn't included in your "proof." And as others have pointed out many 4 ref sellers are having a hard time selling keys. You're a troll that's clearly trying to profit at other people's expense. Hopefully karma will come back to bite you in the ass.

take some screenshots of you buying keys at 3.66 ref please. and I don't think 4 ref is a burden to sell especially when http://scrap.tf/keys sell keys at 4 ref and they still sold out. "I am a troll that's clearly trying to profit at other people's expense" Lol, I'm so sorry that it is wrong for me to update price with proof.

You want screenshots? Here's screenshots:

http://imageshack.us/a/img189/5217/17432769.jpg

http://imageshack.us/a/img248/473/22902362.jpg

http://imageshack.us/a/img688/8590/61241966.jpg (He was buying Zeph's greed for 1 ref and treated key as 3.66 ref.)

http://imageshack.us/a/img9/126/61622525.jpg

the last one is the only one that happened after 3.77-3.88 got accepted. the rest is trades from the time when the range is 3.66.

4 trades in a week. very successful indeed. /s.

Actually the last two are from when the range was 3.77-3.88. And even when I bought the first two, suggestions to raise the price to 3.77-3.88 were still active. So please don't pretend that it's impossible to buy keys at 3.66 ref when I just disproved you.

"suggestions to raise the price to 3.77-3.88 were still active"

but it still didn't get accepted and finance at that time still show the price lingering around 3.7-3.77

A guy just sold me a key for 3.88 ref because he was unable to find any buyers at 4 ref. Those sellers on Outpost selling for 4.33 ref, etc. are probably getting 0 buyers.

4.33 is a joke

Unfortunately, it won't be a joke in a month. :(

4.33 ref keys! Coming to a computer near you!

BREAKING NEWS: EA CEO John Spaghettilio caught trying to buff price of keys in the tf2 economy in a bizzare move to crash the tf2 economy in order to bankrupt Valve.

More at 11.

Aren't you the guy that tried to manipulate Tux prices?

http://backpack.tf/vote/id/5126d3714bd7b87812000001

You people keep griping that the price is going up too fast, ya wanna know why?

Because people on outpost demand more for them, and the stupid people go, "DURRRRRRRRR ILL TAKE IT FOR 4.99". I'm just trying to point this out kthxbai

In all honesty, this is right. Keys will cease to rise when no one can afford them except the richest people. For some reason, buyers are able/willing to pay a ton. There are over 470,000 keys, yet buyers act like there is a shortage or some halloween thing happening. At some point, the price will settle when people stop paying and only idlers pay.

The real problem is that once the price settles, it will probably still be too high. :/

The thread of comments here exceed a typical youtube comment

btw key value dropped in steam market bought 7 at 1.8$ http://i.imgur.com/Mjva9df.png

As price suggestions raise for Keys, so do prices on TF2 Outpost so its a REDICULOUS CYCLE THAT KEEPS GOING. to make it worse.... this guy has 627 keys -_-.... like really, your the one who suggested raise THREE TIMES ALREADY, your causing nothing but trouble

Don't be naive, this would happen with or without a suggestion....

Don't blame the raise in key prices on Bp.tf (or Long)....

What happens:

So the one to blame are the buyers who are willing to pay these key prices..... bp.tf might be speeding the process along, but it would happen with or without bp.tf

blame the buyers whom paying 4 ref , if peoples stopping to pay 3 ref just in a week the value will drop to 3 ref .

Although this has so much awesome proof, I can't help but to downvote. This is getting out of hand .I mean, who wants the economy to crash?

"I'm not commenting."

I knew that wouldn't happen ;)

I hate these rising key prices so much, I would really like for them to just stabilize already...

i just hate these suggestions because i feel the need to deal with all the "geniuses" who think there economists....

They only come out of the key suggestions. They leave all the other ones to you :P

I agree though, too many people think they know what they're talking about. No one knows for sure why this is happening, but we all can agree it sucks. But there is no point in bickering over it. Bickering won't stop this :(

Long218 is trying to break trough the 4 refined wall! Will he destroy it?

Im getting sick of this shit, anything past 4 ref Im downvoting instantly.

Managed to sell 5 at 4 ref

downvoting. everyone knows the first suggestion doesnt go through. you got to make it twice

Any comment hating on long = likes on

Any comment supporting range, whether having Actual proof or not, = dislikes on

Wow this community.

It's pretty pathetic, it gets really old seeing "top" comments that are nothing more than mindless ranting that contributes nothing to the discussion.

scrap.tf is sold out at 4 refined. Several 4 ref sellers sold out on Outpost. Finance reporting a 3.88 average for the last few days. Despite the votes here, I think this price is more accurate than the current 3.77 - 3.88.