Suggestion: Mann Co. Supply Crate Key at 4.88–5.11 ref

Price Suggestion

~57.22 ref

1118 votes up

1479 votes down

Related Suggestions

This suggestion was closed Mon, 06 May 13 05:25:11 +0000 by SirJjjon.

Comments can no longer be left on this suggestion.

Comments

First of all, why would sales that go in literally seconds should be use as counter proof ? Wouldn't that make them a quicksell which should never be used as proof ?When there are 50+ something readily buyers at 4.88 or above, why would anyone sell you key at a lower price than that ? If I were to post proof of young trades of price off the range on other items mods would declined and say they sold too quick and should not be use as proof so why not in this case ?

Beside, there are thousands of key trades per day so when people counter proof with a mere 6-9 links, the percent is way too small to be even consider.

http://tf2finance.com/keys/ 5.06 http://puu.sh/2Md5Q.png

Sorry if duplicate links.

Buyers trades at 4.88 or higher

http://www.tf2outpost.com/trade/10510006 5

http://www.tf2outpost.com/trade/10341568 4.88

http://www.tf2outpost.com/trade/10487523 5

http://www.tf2outpost.com/trade/10478321 5

http://www.tf2outpost.com/trade/10509947 5

http://www.tf2outpost.com/trade/10373341 4.88

http://www.tf2outpost.com/trade/10510053 5

http://www.tf2outpost.com/trade/10485109 5

http://www.tf2outpost.com/trade/10496569 5-5.11

http://www.tf2outpost.com/trade/10498392 5

http://www.tf2outpost.com/trade/10510880

http://www.tf2outpost.com/trade/10497002

http://redd.it/1dkp86

http://redd.it/1dklhv 5.22

http://www.tf2outpost.com/trade/10470704

http://www.tf2outpost.com/trade/9176672 4.88

http://www.tf2outpost.com/trade/10357672 5

http://www.tf2outpost.com/trade/10414251 5

http://www.tf2outpost.com/trade/10426943 4.88

http://www.tf2outpost.com/trade/10497644 5

http://www.tf2outpost.com/trade/10489145 5

http://www.tf2outpost.com/trade/10504969 5.11

http://www.tf2outpost.com/trade/10502131 4.88

http://www.tf2outpost.com/trade/10507862 5

http://www.tf2outpost.com/trade/10500067 5

http://www.tf2outpost.com/trade/9986000 5

http://www.tf2outpost.com/trade/10509799

http://www.tf2outpost.com/trade/10503165

http://www.tf2outpost.com/trade/10494924

http://www.tf2outpost.com/trade/10493309

http://www.tf2outpost.com/trade/10440277

http://www.tf2outpost.com/trade/10424553

http://www.tf2outpost.com/trade/10455082

http://www.tf2outpost.com/trade/10490566

http://www.tf2outpost.com/trade/10480532

http://www.tf2outpost.com/trade/10501274

http://www.tf2outpost.com/trade/10379977

http://www.tf2outpost.com/trade/8440932

http://www.tf2outpost.com/trade/10507429

http://www.tf2outpost.com/trade/10317680

http://www.tf2outpost.com/trade/10503627

http://www.tf2outpost.com/trade/10289133 5.11

http://www.tf2outpost.com/trade/10256058

http://www.tf2outpost.com/trade/10485891

http://www.tf2outpost.com/trade/10494615

http://www.tf2outpost.com/trade/10228857

http://www.tf2outpost.com/trade/10500845 5.11

http://www.tf2outpost.com/trade/10495820

http://www.tf2outpost.com/trade/10507614

http://www.tf2outpost.com/trade/10494867 4.88

http://www.tf2outpost.com/trade/10475776

http://www.tf2outpost.com/trade/10133444

http://www.tf2outpost.com/trade/10455152

http://www.tf2outpost.com/trade/10460155

http://www.tf2outpost.com/trade/10415151

http://www.tf2outpost.com/trade/10509880

http://www.tf2outpost.com/trade/10510494 5.11

http://www.tf2outpost.com/trade/10507072 5.22

http://www.tf2outpost.com/trade/10490680

Sellers:

These are the 3 experimental trades at 5.11 which all sold out already at 5.11(less than one day)

http://www.tf2outpost.com/trade/10510507

http://www.tf2outpost.com/trade/10510504

http://www.tf2outpost.com/trade/10510516 stock at 6

Sellers that sold at 4.88 or higher

http://www.tf2outpost.com/trade/10335007 many adds at 5.11

http://www.tf2outpost.com/trade/10510507 4.88 offer

http://www.tf2outpost.com/trade/10489584

http://www.tf2outpost.com/trade/10500584 2 offers at 5

http://www.tf2outpost.com/trade/10498640 add at 5.22

http://www.tf2outpost.com/trade/10493149 sold 2 at 5.11

http://www.tf2outpost.com/trade/10438422 51 for 10 keys offer.

http://www.tf2outpost.com/trade/10346649 add at 5.33

http://www.tf2outpost.com/trade/10510338 sold at 5.11 in 3 minutes

http://www.tf2outpost.com/trade/10441024

http://www.tf2outpost.com/trade/10510374 sold in one minute at 5

http://www.tf2outpost.com/trade/10432964 sold at 5.33

http://www.tf2outpost.com/trade/10494634 offer of 5

http://www.tf2outpost.com/trade/10471188 5 or 5.22 add

http://www.tf2outpost.com/trade/10345000 add at 5.22

http://www.tf2outpost.com/trade/10501274

http://www.tf2outpost.com/trade/9788015 offer of 5

http://www.tf2outpost.com/trade/10532713 add at 5.11

http://www.tf2outpost.com/trade/9923335 add for 5.33

http://www.tf2outpost.com/trade/10364490 sold at 5.22

Please don't bother comment unrelated or rude stuff.

Sorry if duplicate links

Here we go again T.T

Just when I thought Long might be building up his rep in recent days, he fUks it all up. (not a bad word)

buying keys for 5 ref, i m not joking. Add me.

go away

If your suggestion doesn't get approved, just submit another one instantly!

http://puu.sh/2Mlil.png sold at 5 within 40 seconds.

http://www.tf2outpost.com/trade/10537016 add at 5.22

http://www.tf2outpost.com/trade/10432617 sold at 5.11

http://www.tf2outpost.com/trade/10538469

http://www.tf2outpost.com/trade/10253054 sold a lot

Wasn't there just one of these? btw some cult wrote me to help them get proof that keys are lowering. I couldn't find any proof. I constantly sell keys at 5.11 ref. I usually throw out 1 at a time because 3 people will add me in about 5 seconds.

Honestly, his suggestions are fine, just too early.

But Outpost, is getting far out of hand.

This is what I got after opening a trade selling keys for 4.88, after waiting 1 minute.

http://imgur.com/mag8Xj3

While I'm sure those are friend invites, that only shows that you have 5 notifications which could be 5 unread chat messages from someone.

well metaldrake1 thank you for sharing your inlog details.

Good god, just make keys 6 ref and get it over with

but we would have to update 4 hours later!

What I wanna know is, what was the question that Brad accepted during the Kritzcast?

what he is planning to add on to bp.tf in 2013.

I didn't get a chance to here the cast so is there a link?

http://www.tf2outpost.com/trade/10556202 add instantly at 5 http://puu.sh/2MHTX.png

http://www.tf2outpost.com/trade/10556082

http://www.tf2outpost.com/trade/10554567

http://www.tf2outpost.com/trade/10381624 sold at 5.22

http://www.tf2outpost.com/trade/10562077 5 ref offer

http://www.tf2outpost.com/trade/10562188 sold all 3 in less than a minute

http://www.tf2outpost.com/trade/10562532 add at 5.11

http://redd.it/1dp5ak

http://www.tf2outpost.com/trade/10566911 sold instantaniously at 5

http://www.tf2outpost.com/trade/10567535

http://www.tf2outpost.com/trade/10567533

http://redd.it/1dpdwu

http://redd.it/1dparr

http://www.tf2outpost.com/trade/10564468

Lol, I like how people come and downvote all three of them because they're "against what they WANT"

http://www.tf2outpost.com/trade/10568764 add within 50 seconds.

http://www.tf2outpost.com/trade/10514678 offer of 5.11

Hey Long, you've probably seen me posting on other key suggestions. I don't really care about them rising anymore, but if you literally said:

"why would sales that go in literally seconds should be use as counter proof ? Wouldn't that make them a quicksell which should never be used as proof"

Aren't some of the trades you're putting up going more or less instantly, making them, by your definition, 'quicksells'?

Also why is it that you've been alright on other posts, but the people who post the suggestions (especially Mattje) suddenly become very rude? That is the main thing that annoys me when some of the suggestions get accepted, when the suggester is just being extremely rude, even to people with legitimate counterproof?

Also on bazaar.tf, the less outrageous trading website, I've seen very few people getting sales for keys selling for 4.99+. But I've also seen people buying unsuccessfully for 4.88 and lower. I'd say the price is ok for now, shouldn't go up or down, but that's just me.

"suddenly become very rude?"

because there is a lot of hate. I have been hate since my very first key suggestion which is 3 refined. It just keep getting worst and I had to disable my comment function on my profile because people keep raging and threatening me on my wall. I got tired of their behavior and treat them the same way they did to me.

yawn

U shuld liek go to bed

Viewing his backpack makes my computer lag.

Heh, im not very strong at economy. But i know that every item has it maximum price and when this item will reach it, it will immediately lose it price. We dont need to be rage :) We need to wait a little bit. I think that somewhere at near future key will be 3 ref) And guys, sorry for my English. Its just my opinion!

no....it won't. metal is worthless.

The thing is, metal has no use at this point. Keys have a use. This will keep going for a long time.

ba dum tss

That was a [i]cleverpun[/b] you made there.

your thing didnt work

Need to buy 20+ keys at 5 ref. each. If nobody adds me then I'll upvote this key suggestion. If you want the prices to do down then add me and do the trade.

At first, I saw tf2outpost with a bunch of people buying for 5 ref. But then I saw this suggestion! And I hesitated to make a 5-5.33 suggestion. THE MARKET IS SCREWED UP! REMEMBER THE TIMES WHEN THE KEY WAS JUST 2.66!

ah i remember those days D; , at this point i don't bother doing metal to key trades (much less vote on keys because ik how its going to end up)

Remember the day when there were no keys. Simple and prosperous.

i got on back in sept. so i havent been on that long, though i do remember keys being like, half the price they are now XP

feel free to get out of outpost and enjoy the game.

i never said i disagreed with the price you suggested, a lot of people DO buy/sell keys at the suggestions you've been making, and i'm definitely not blaming you for the skyrocket in keys prices, their are way more factors affecting it then just one person

if we keep ignoring quicksell's and never put them in the range the price for keys will continue to rise with no end

and why exactly would we have to take quicksell price into consideration when they sold way too fast and you have to sit and wait for a long time to get them ?

they sell for that much don't they?

the range must reflect quicksells as well if not the price of keys will never settle.

quicksells in all items must be part of the range of the price

if we want a fair pricing system then we must include quicksellers of all items in the range including unusual promo pure tools items

But where do you draw the line? What if somebody quicksells for 1 ref? Should the range then be 1 ref to 5.55 keys if 1 person also successfully sells higher? There must be outliers. Outliers are the uncommon trades, quicksells by definition are not the "common" trades and thus must be excluded.

if it is possible for a quickseller to buy keys for 4.88 then it is possible for everyone,

if it is possible for everyone the price must reflect in the range

doesn't matter if it is about keys or vintage bill.

thats my opinion.

if you have a significant number of buyers willing to pay more than 4.88 then the price should be more, though it is true wait your saying, at what point do "quicksells" become legitimate proof for a fall (or raise) in price? keys are just one of those items a lot of people want for different reasons so your gona have a lot of trades including them

personally i was buying keys for 4 ref when keys where 4.66-4.88

good proof, upvoted

Nice proof and logic, upvote.

What is different from your suggestion that you posted 24 hours ago that was rejected?

( His post from yesterday http://backpack.tf/vote/id/5182d319ba2536bd77000003 )

he think a few links of willing sellers at 4.66 mean a lot on item that get sold by thousands daily.

But wouldn't keys selling around that price (4.66-4.77) validate the current pricing range? Since it shows that keys are still being sold within that range.

I'm sure the current range will decrease soon, but this seems slightly premature.

so if there is a group with a few people posting trades at 4.66(who know if they even sell) and then people use those as counter proof, then a small group would be able to manipulate key price ?

If I sold a bud for a key because I REALLY needed that key, would the price of a bud change to 1-22 keys?

No because you are one person, if a good portion of the market did this then sure.

http://nooooooooooooooo.com/

Yes... http://mirrors.rit.edu/instantCSI/

The who. :D

Excuse me while I go to the doctors to get my ear checked.

http://nonono.info is better... lol

dis sux eggs.

Glad to see your comment adds so much to the discussion at hand, providing analysis of the links provided, or even a reason as to why this suggestion is good or bad.

np awesome guy

why do you want me to discuss if it doesnt changes anything, lastest suggestions were accept with -871 score and the other with -170.

How's that relevant to this suggestion?

I don't think it really qualifies as a quicksell if people sell keys for a scrap or 2 below the range. I mean sure you can get more but that's because keys are in huge demand and people don't mind paying extra just to get them, especially since they're going up so quick.

If an adequate amount of people sell keys slightly below the range and there's enough for proof then it should be taken into consideration and not disregarded because they are able to be sold very quickly.

too bad a few links are not enough for proof when I was able to link 50+ links to counter those mesely proof at 4.66-4.77.

That's because people are capable of selling them that high and more importantly people are willing to pay that high. It's pretty common sense that people will want to get as much as they can for their keys so of course there's going to be a lot more sales on the higher end. That being said there was still a good amount of proof of keys being sold at around 4.66.

He never was interested in play TF2, while the keys were being made more expensive in metal, more people began to buy them via paypal and that's where Long218 take advantage to sell more keys via paypal. (Example he is only now cashing out)

I left here this http://steamrep.com/profiles/76561198042823837

So backpack.tf lets people with private backpacks and dirty rep make keys suggestions WOW

They also let someone reply to there own comment 3 times....so clearly they are pretty lax about a lot of things.

I'm sorry, are you aware of something called a logical fallacy?

http://www.logicalfallacies.info/relevance/ad-hominem/

"Since Long218 has been marked on Steamrep and on Valve, as well as having a private backpack, he is therefore not knowledgeable of the market." is your argument, and a very flawed one. While I personally do not get along very well with him, I would argue that he is better suited to the suggestion than you simply due to the fact that he dedicated his time to trading, and on a large scale (as is shown by the number of keys he accrued over time) as opposed to playing a game for fun or, in your case, attacking a person rather than showing counterproof.

He may not play anymore but still...

Some people just wanna see the world burn.

-12 point. Why? Who knows.

The most hilarious part about you trying to be intelligent is that you're completely oblivious to the point of his argument.

Agree bp.tf reputation is droping day by day..

Yes and thats why I dont trust bp price suggestion like before I did

Not sure if I don't go on Steamrep enough, but I've never seen anyone with a Reddit caution before today.

How's that relevant to this suggestion?

If you haven't noticed, I was considering 5.11 as "expensive trades" and 4.66 as "cheap trades" when I accepted the last suggestion. I just closed the suggestion but for some reason you just want more drama. CAN'T. YOU. WAIT?!

He only want sell more keys via paypal

He can't sell shit from his backpack... he's permanently tradebanned.

yawn

do you even read what I posted ?

"How do you know it is permanent and it is a ban ? It does not say so on my profile does it ?"

Because if it weren't permanent your pack would be wiped. Valve isn't about to let you keep a bunch of keys bought on stolen credit cards

too bad 4.66 only happen very very rarely.

if 4.66 and 4.77 need to be in range because there is a few people sold at that price why wouldn't any quicksell prices for items were to be put into the range too ?

Not sure where you're buying/selling, but on trade servers I go on, I regularly see keys being bought and sold at 4.66-4.88.

pics or didn't happen.

also, why didn't you buy them and then resell at 5 easily ?

Because I'm not an asshole. People I respect sell them for slightly lower then average, I then either use them or sell them to other people for about the same price. I'd get pics now, but I'm busy.

Would you mind to close this Suggestion as well, as the difference between this Suggestion and his previous one are mere 3 Hours.

Just cut the chase and close the suggestion, then.

The suggestion is wrong from the first line anyways, by calling keys sold for a scrap under the range "quicksells" only because people are desperate for cheap keys and they snag them up ASAP.

He is right, they are quicksells. When I accepted the other suggestion, I was accepting quicksells in the range. I alsao accepted the fact that they do sell for 5.11. I'm staying out of this one, althought I think it should be closed.

Maybe we should get a better definition of when it is a quicksell or not, because it is determined solely on how fast they sell and not also because of for how much it deviates from the range, then you could say that the bottom of the current range is also quicksell.

One scrap under the range when selling isn't that much either, unless you're selling large quantities.

The fact that keys being sold at less than 4.88 are INSTANTLY bought, make them quicksells. Keys are 5 ref on average. I'm considering keys to be 4.66-5.11 because you *can* buy a key for 4.66 an you can sell a key for 5.22, even 5.33. Hell, I honestly thinkt he fairesdt thing would be to make the key price 4.66-5.33.

Wouldn't be the correct bottom of range then be 4.88, common sense aside?

That or make quicksells be allowed as proof, as long there are enough of them.

You seem to be the only non-douchebag admin / mod on here... Maybe you will actually listen to me?

I use bazaar.tf, and as far as I've seen, very few people are able to sell keys for the higher range, but people are also getting almost no buys for the lower range (if that makes sense?).

Also thanks to the rudeness of your main contributors and mods / admins, the site is losing reputation day by day. I'm sorry, but even people like Vincent are, and have been, extremely rude.

You are the only admin I have respect for at the moment. Either get new, more reliable admins who respect the WHOLE of the trading community, or make them actually give half a crap of people's views and OPINIONS.

I'm not having a go at you, you are actually alright. Just please understand how quickly this website will go down if you continue to accept suggestions from these rude people. Have you not realized that most of the rude people are the ones who are ok with the suggestions, and continue to sell for the higher prices?

Some example of mods being rude would be nice(or is it just because they accept key suggestions?

who even use bazaar ?

People who like a better trading experience use bazaar.

Mattje is a prime example of being rude, but also Vincent is rude, but without using actual rude words. I don't mind the fact that the suggestions get accepted, I was before, but now it doesn't really bother me. It's the fact they don't even try to explain anything. Some might as well be saying "GTFO u butthurt fagget lelelele". I would have much more respect if they actually explained why they were accepting a suggestion, or if they actually said why some counter-proof wasn't viable, not just "Qiucksell" or "out of date", when some of the original proof is exactly that.

Please call me out if you see me being rude. I try to act with a degree of professionalism, I'll want to know when I fail to do so.

If you mean I'm rude by not explaining when I accept/reject, again, please point out to me when I do. I always try to give an explanation when I accept or close against the common vote.

The only problem I have with the team at the moment is that we act independently because we lack a set of rules/guidelines, with will be fixed soon.

The rudeness of top contributors should not mean anything. They aren't part of the team, they are just the ones who help us the most. If any of them is rude enough to you to deserve a warning or even a ban, please report him on the forums (We lack a report system on the comments, it would probably be mass abused anyways). You mentioned Vincent being ruse, I have the utmost respect for him and I doubt he's was being rude for no reason. Perhaps someone provoked him. If any mod is rude to anyone for no reason, report him as well.

Bazaar is a really fair trading site, as they don't allow quicksellers/quickbuyers. The problem with that is that they lower the profit any trader could make. You can buy an item on outpost for 7 keys, but bazaar won't allow you because it's a lowball. The amount of trades that happen there compared to outpost it's just too few.

As people on both sides complain about the higher and lower range, I was thinking about including BOTH on the price. For example: make keys 4.77-5.22. http://forums.backpack.tf/index.php?/topic/1301-poll-on-key-prices/

it seems to me that keys go for a lot of different prices with at least moderate frequency would definitely be interesting to see keys at 4.77-5.22. at what point do "quicksells" become common enough to be a legit part of the range?

there's no math formula for that, we just have to consider what we think is accurate. After all, this is just a guide.

a guide that sparks discussions (from a single suggestion) that rival those about politics XP, but ya you guys do the best u can

When Chief Shoe himself gets tired of key suggestions, sh*t gets real.

You're a joke. The entire Backpack.tf staff are a massive massive joke. The guy is trade restricted and has a private backpack. Why the fuck isn't he banned from the site yet? That's enough for him to be banned ANYWHERE else.

Stop being so damn spineless and do something, the longer people like this are allowed to make suggestions, the longer you and all the staff are made to look like complete tools.

If he steps over the line, we'll ban him. If steamrep marks him, he won't be able to access the site.

If you want us to start banning people for no reason, then let me know so I can test it with you. We already warned him and gave him a ban from key suggestions. I'm letting Vincent handle his attitude in this because he's the one that gave him the ban. (By the way the ban is over, it was for 2 weeks I think)

He's still marked on Steamrep. Any mark should be sufficient.

"If you want us to start banning people for no reason, then let me know so I can test it with you"

Classy, real classy. Just another fine example to add to the ever increasing pile. Backbone, get one and accept valid criticism, or just ban me. Either is fine, either selection shows you have the gall to make a damn decision, but do not threaten me as that just shows complete weakness.

Actually on the key suggestion: Long is completely right here, this suggestion should have been accepted yesterday, keys very easily sell in the range he proposed.

Insulting an admin who just threatened to ban you might not be the best idea, friend.

So what? If the price rises here, it will rise on Outpost. It's a cycle. Do people not understand this?

Except outpost has already been selling at 5.33...

No reason? Are you kidding?

http://tinypic.com/view.php?pic=3515mzc&s=5

One in a long list of things he's done and said on this site that would be more than enough.

Seriously, You guys have blocked an entire group for implying that they're going to try and manipulate key prices and yet you do nothing but come up with excuses to let a trade restricted rep-whore vote spammer who got caught dealing in carded keys that has clearly stated his intentions are to screw up the market stay and continue to manipulate key prices.

And you wonder why people are suspicious about what's going on here?

What the fuck? I thought you got banned from suggesting key prices.

NOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO......... WHYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYY?

................. another one..... yay

still, no proof of people not able to buy keys 4.77, why repeat this suggestion? you cant trade, your keys are worthless.

Long, do you know what you are doing? Don't bother making another suggestion, when your last one was closed, common sense huh?

First of all why the hell do you keep wanting to rais the price of keys? i upvoted last time but seeing as it got closed and wow look here! anoher suggestion for keys!!!! no this isnt a suggestion this is greed. downvote

He is trade banned so he cant trade his 642 keys lol

well thats great news, it just looked a little dodgy that he is always suggesting key prices to my knowlege when he has over 600 of the fuckers

But he could easily have an alt account that we don't know of with another 600 keys in it.

if the last one lost so will this one most likely. I actually do agree that 4.77 keys are few and far between. 5 ref keys are the standard currently. The cost of keys really is a separator between those with $ and those without.

>was complaining about people making key suggestions few hours after someone accepted it

>adding new suggestion few minutes after admin closed his suggestion

LOL, I will say it again - hilarious hypocrite and it's sad to see (maybe funny, idk)

Can someone can prevent him from doing key suggestions? I know admins did that few weeks ago.

anyone that's trade banned should not be able to make suggestions, period.

funny cuz I don't see this kind of comment until I start suggesting key.

funny cuz I don't see a reason to put up another suggestion, with the same proof, when it was closed. Please, you still haven't shown people unable to buy keys at 4.77, 4.88 and higher is in the current range already.

I don't see a point of this, people suggest you to be rebanned because you should. This is completely immature.

Hey Admins, can we get Long rebanned from making key suggestions?

Not only this guy, but also that Mattje character and also that Raw Hatch Beryl or whatever his/her name is, they're the driving force behind this bs

Thats basically banning a majority of the contributors to this site...

Long makes good suggestions but starts being a douche on key suggestions, long just dont comment to and let the proof do the talking...

it's banning only from key suggestions. Thay can still contribute a lot with other suggestions, right?

"let the proof do the talking..."

my second comment of proof got 23 dislikes.

lel.

so much butthurt

Awww, you didn't even get my name right...

keep making key suggestion, and people will know you at least as Hatch (funny what this word mean in russian language also).

bush told me I needed to increase key price

Not only that, but we need to ban some of the admins, they accept pricing suggestions when they have hundreds of negative votes.

lol

cuz obviously vote is not bias at all.

amirite ?

So? basically your saying screw democracy? am i rite?

but then people want gas and tax to lower but does it lower ? nope.

Not the same thing, I'am pretty sure you of all people know how this works you make a suggestion provide proof, the people vote on it if the majority votes yes or no, then that majority vote passes and if the votes are close the Admins then decide which is correct.

At least that's what happens with all other item suggestions except keys.

edit: I said a majority,even so if people vote for there own benefit not everyone would, that's why it's a "majority" and not just one person is voting, to the guys below this comment i don't think i have to explain what a democracy is and why i works better than any other form of government

vote doesn't solely decide the outcome of a suggestion.

didn you saw suggestions that get accepted with negative vote because enough proof and suggestions with lot of points but get closed ?

Most people don't vote on whether or not the proof is good, they vote on the fact that they have keys or no keys. Which is a bias. That's a bad thing.

because the government want more money and gas is scarce. so you're basically saying that you want to raise the price so you can get more money? can we please ban this minor?

Yeah, it's fine when the admins close/accept suggestions when the vote is bias.

http://forums.backpack.tf/index.php?/topic/1311-really-chief-shoes/

i have to agree with that, your suggestions tend to get like -600 votes yet they pass, reason being is that the proof is very often pretty convincing, people just down vote the second they see its by Long.

*peeks from behind the desk waiting for a hail of dislikes*

Last time I blamed a mod, he banned me for 3 days. Maybe there should be a complete overhaul so that prices could be manipulated via the amount of votes a certain suggestion gets.

Then backpack would be wrong on everything. Just because backpack says that keys are now magically 2.55 doesn't mean that outpost would listen.

That's a terrible idea and would make backpack lose all the rep it's built up in the trading community.

'this bs'

You mean reporting what keys are actually going for?

Someones pissed off that they're too poor to afford keys.

P.s just because you're poor and can't afford it, doesn't mean its wrong.

u just curupt membr u dun liek his bp 2 b mur.

Me too..... I want to be hated

No need to ban him, let him do all the work. When he stops suggesting then there won't be anymore suggestions for the most part.

im upvoting, as always..

maybe is sad and we dont want them to go up, but reality isnt what we want.

dude

it's a game

and if we can get what we want then why hold back?

-_-

If a "retard" make a suggestion and get passed, then he probably not a retard.

if a "retard" makes a suggestion and gets accepted then probably the acceptors are retards aswell get it, majority downvotes you now gtfo of bp.tf and leave us alone D:

If the "accepters" (known as admins in interweb language) are "so retarded", why don't you just go apply to be one and fix this whole mess :) (the sarcasm in that statement is unbearable)

I would but they wouldnt accept me would they?

No, because you are "so retarded". AS YOU SAID, THE PRICE OF KEYS IS NOT WHAT YOU WANT LOOK AT THE MARKET AND STOP BEING AN IGNORAMUS BEFORE YOU ATTACK SOMEBODY FOR MAKING AN ACCURATE SUGGESTION. K thx bai.

ease up on the caps son, the suggestion is accurate indeed but retarded

Admins don't accept you, the only person who accepts new Mods is Brad, and brad could care less about key values.

XD i love how my comment attacking long got warned but not the one attacking admins indirectly, i guess long is more respected than a admin here

No, your just not suposed to directly insult a person by calling them names, if I were to do the same to you, I would be warned.

Voting on key suggestions arnt considered because everyone is biased, you could open a suggestion with keys going 2.66 refs with no proof and you'll get aheap of upvotes, dont lie to yourself thinking everyone is honest.

Thats why if you're going to downvote/argue back you'll need proof :)

I like how you state that its sad that the prices go up, while you have a nice key in the classifieds for 5.55 ;)

Oh Long, you little rascal!

Oh goody. Mr. Carded Key Buyer is back making a key suggestion again. Sometimes I wonder if he anything representing a life outside TF2 trading, what with him blowing $900 on carded keys.

$900 could have done something more productive than buying some meaningless pixels. I doubt anyone else would have blown that much on TF2 items in one sitting..

Just my two cents.

not my money anyway.

I never use any of my real life money into this game.

Do you rob banks? :v

Or you bought carded keys with imaginary money?

he probaly just sells keys. then buy a bunch of keys really cheap for less then a dollar from carders.

You can buy keys with $900 and turn them into $2000. I think you could do more with $2000

Or he could have made a car payment... or a rent payment... or go out on a few dates... or picked out jewelry for a girlfriend. Instead, he decided to blow it all on pixels.

Perhaps I am not looking at this the right way, but you have to be a complete idiot to blow that much money on virtual items. Even people buying keys would spend less than $100. But hey, I'm not the one who traded with a key carder. What the hell do I know?

it called an investment.

too bad this one was not as good as the other ones I did.

What's your problem, man? Are you new to the internet?

also, who are you to tell anyone what to do with their money? Look at Mattie, he's loaded and wants to buy hats worth thousand of dollars. Let him be happy.

Stop the personal attacks or see yourself banned.

You are comparing apples and oranges with Mattie and Long218. Mattie is one of the founders of SteamRep, and has a backpack that is almost worth 40 large. He is widely respected in the TF2 community and the trading community at large. When his account was hijacked, you had users bending over backwards trying to help nail the culprit who did it. There is a user that cares about his community, and you have to consider he double checks (and even triple checks) who is trading because of the stakes he is playing with. He works with Valve, so technically he has money to burn.

Long218...

If the admins themselves have taken swipes at him, it's not really considered a personal attack. Long218 pretty much has done nothing to mask his arrogance in the past, and others like Baloo, cleverpun, Vincent, even YOU don't sympathize with him. You were the one who gave him the warning on the Key Manipulator suggestion. He has his main account banned from SourceOp, TF2Outpost, and Reddit. Frequenting the Steam forums, Long is overwhelmingly loathed due to his behavior.

There are reasons why Outpost traders for the most part are leery about money trades, because it is impossible to know whom to trust, and you are always worried that somehow you can be ripped off. Even when the trade is being made, you're always worried that you'll be caught in a cashback scam. I'd be worried about trading anything over $100 myself on Outpost.

Long just went ahead and paid over $900 without even thinking about the consequences, and then claimed he had no knowledge of the transaction AFTER the carder was marked on SteamRep. He could have just double and triple checked the situation, and also he could have just said no. But... here we are now.

Perhaps I am looking at this the wrong way, but if you are spending that much on items, you have to double and triple check the history to see that evey single item has a clean history. You cannot cite laziness or lack of attention into the matter. You don't check the item histories of the keys, earbuds, bills and other items, and even one of those items being linked to a hijacked account or a carded account will have you wind up like long, with a value totaling more than four figures, but unable to trade because of lack of attention.

Just remember folks... with high valued items being traded, measure twice (even three times) and cut once.

If you don't know anything don't even talk.

I stopped trading with the carder right after he got marked and I even notify it to helen so she could try to help me out.

I could not check the item history because it was on an alt and the alt was not on outpost. and I am a noob with cash trading, that is why I got charged back a ton of money.

You could have always said no, Long, and you would not be in the predicament you are in today. Even if it was on an alt, you should have been cautious about who you were trading.

The problem is that you went ahead with the transaction without thinking about the consequences. You should have checked to see if anything was shady on his account. And citing not being experienced with cash trades is no excuse, because with a transaction that risky, you have to double and triple check to see if he was a legitimate buyer.

I don't care if it is exhausting, but talking to the owners of an item would have prevented you from being banned. Even talking to someone who shows up second or third from the top in the trade history would have prevented you from being banned.

Is this a joke? There are widely circulated screen grabs of your chats proving you knowing bought stolen keys and suggested others do the same as you yourself do.

because people should take everything I said seriously.

especially to a /b/fag(he called himself that) troll such as andy.

Dude. You can make a car payment with $900...or make a better one with $2000. Up to you.

damn, that could be gas money for a few weeks.

How's that relevant to this suggestion?

90% of the comment is not relevant to this suggestion.

they just want to attack the suggestor.

but I learned not to care anyway.

I'm getting bored of such spamming comments.

All I want to see is: "downvote, because [insert counterproof here]" or "upvote, because [insert extra proof here]".

Or questions about the suggested range.

No bullcrap like many of these comments.

We're going to take action against useless comments like his when the guidelines are out.

http://imgur.com/a/0G9If

This kid must be bi-polar or something, so much hypocrisy.

"owns: 642"

Greed. It always seem to make its way

He's trade restricted and can't trade anything in his back´pack. All his items are worthless.

hahahahaha

Karma is awesome.

Apart from items on alts. I'd really love to see backpack.tf include; a system where valve trade bans are acted upon in the same way as SR scammer tags. Would an admin be kind enough to let me know why this is not the case? I understand coding might take time, but you still have that manual ban button.

So it's permanent?

Apparently, yes.

Oh wow. JUST UNBOX ALL YOUR KEYS LONG!

Who on earth has 642 crates laying around?

Just idle.

I have about 450... Is that good? ._.

What's it like being antisocial? I have to do a report for my Psychology class, so if you could help me out, I'd appreciate it.

sounds like you took the class and still didn't learn anything.

Anti-social is when you hate people not when people hate you.

especially when they hate you because you did something right but against their will.

"Anti-social behaviour is behaviour that lacks consideration for others and may cause damage to the society, whether intentionally or through negligence."

At the very least, you're a huge narcissistic cock who's bad at video games

http://transmedialshakespeare.files.wordpress.com/2012/08/kelso-burn.jpg

at the very least you have no fucking idea what you are talking about and need to shut up. psychology classes my ass, did you sleep trough them?

Ruining the games economy for personal profit is the right thing to do? I wonder if you would still want the price of keys higher if you didn't have hundreds of them.

How's that relevant to this suggestion?

inb4 shitstorm

2l8

These key suggestions keep coming back like a bad case of herpes.

How's that relevant to this suggestion?

its a joke, take a chill pill bro, no need for a circle jerk

Is that the only thing you say?

No, if somebody would post serious counterproof, I can say: "good counterproof, I'll downvote this suggestion."

Or if anyone asks a decent question, and I can answer it, I'll do, like your question.

All the other spam is unneeded in these suggestions.

Please just fucking stop. Please? You only have to stop.

All these people complaining when this is the most accurate price suggestion over the past little while.

So outpost with two links from reddit are the only two entities that make up the entire TF2 community and therefore are the sole actors in establishing a new value for keys on the backpack.tf pricelist? There's more to the market for keys than outpost and being sucked in by Long's use of cherry-picked links to prove a point is nearsighted.

there are a ton more links on reddit at 5 since the 4.66-5.11 suggestion but I am just too lazy(and impossible/irrelevant) since they were sometime ago.

Sometime ago would imply they are outdated and it says in the rules to suggest on price changes on items that you strongly believe in. To openly admit laziness towards your own suggestion proves how little you care about keys and their price.

just click on tf2trade again and saw this as the latest trade http://redd.it/1dnoid

>Lazy

>Contributes to TF2's ever worsening economy

A friend of mine also posted a trade on /r/tf2trade paying 5.11 ref each for 4 keys (20.44 ref). He got it in less than 1 minute. I'd say that supports 5.11 as a quickbuy price, not as valid support for a good price.

When did I say anything about Long's proof?

I'm speaking from personal experience. Mine may be different from yours, go cry about it.

I have nothing to cry over. Just an all too familiar sigh to emit from my mouth as I see that when in the face of adversity people revert to name-calling and degradation rather than the facts or a serious discussion. Feel free to provide evidence of your experiences if you truly believed you've taken part in the entire scope of the market for keys and can recount its every move perfectly.

Lol I didn't call you any names or degrade you and I've nothing to prove to you. I don't keep a paper trail of my experiences but simply put, I haven't found a buyer for under 4.88 in about a month now. HOWEVER, maybe you have and maybe other people here have but as I liquidated all of my items, I did not. Keys kept increasing and I stopped buying at a rate of 5 ref.

I don't know why you'd think I can recount every move perfectly... I've been on OP, trade servers etc etc etc and could not find keys for 4.66. If you have, more power to you. But, again, I'm speaking from experience.

Have you seen the other key suggestions by other players then? :S

Explain what you mean by this. Are you referring to previously accepted key suggestions or rather key suggestions on a whole?

You say that less than 10 keys have been sold for 4.77 refined each day, bit here's my counter argument as to why 4.77 refined should still be included in range.

Scrap.tf currently buys keys for 4.77 refined and sells them for 5.11 refined. According to the stats page: [url]http://scrap.tf/stats[/url] there have 136 keys sold today alone. I have asked Geel9 in the past whether that was the sum for both buying and selling or just selling and he stated that the stats page only reflected selling. Therefore 136 keys have been sold to scrap.tf either just today or over the past two days for 4.76 refined. I'd say that equally matches the links you have from outpost and shows a clear reason as to why 4.77 refined should remain in the suggested range for keys.

but then again, it is scrap.tf, people are willing to sell at less for 24/7 service, no haggle and straight forward.

They bought a fair share of bill hats at 7.5 but that does not make bill suggestions that bump dump price pass does it ?

What the hell would a "bump dump price pass" mean? Rhetorical question, anyways what I'm getting at is that you've decided to write off anyone that buys/sells for lower since it must only account for a small percentage in your mind, but do you actually have anything to back you up on that claim or are you just blowing hot air? tf2finance has set parameters for what it traces and does not fully encompass the key market therefore it is subject to scrutiny as to the relative accuracy of its data. Hence one of the reasons base64 does not want to link tf2finance up to backpack.tf as a real-time updater of key prices.

You're forgetting that scrap.tf selling as much keys as it buys and it sells keys for 5.11 refs...

I didn't miss it, there was no reason to mention that since 5.11 refined is ALREADY IN CURRENT RANGE! Therefore adding that fact does nothing to the conversation and you're not contradicting me or proving my argument invalid in any way.

This question goes to all people posting counter proof, not to those crying about the economy and #savethekeys shit.

If we're considering 4.77 to be in the range because SOME people still sell keys for 4.77 VERY fast, should we also include 5.22 or 5.33 because some people sell them at that price??? Serious question. I'd ask on the forums but you all seem to only discuss this on suggestions, no idea why.

Actually, I made a poll. http://forums.backpack.tf/index.php?/topic/1301-poll-on-key-prices/

Vote, I'll try not to reply to any reply to this comment.

but then again,

If there were a small group of people post trades at 4.66-4.77 but are not willing to sell at that price once someone added(by saying they already sold), those proof would still be used as 4.77 proof.

and what about all those 2.33-2.66 trades ?

This,

All of my this.

more people sell for lower prices than people successfully selling for over the suggested price

are you freaking sure about that ?

lol.

yep

now tell me, why were you for the 4.66 suggestion?

what ?

why did you agree to the 4.66-5 ref suggestion? and now you're like "trades that sell in seconds shouldnt be proof"

because back then the range was appropriate but now the amount of willing buyers at 4.88+ are way too massive comparing to successful buyers at 4.66.

back then it was still sold in seconds. but enough people sold at that price

Why are you doing this?

i know u got ur proof but why u have to keep this madness going?

It's only logical that keys will go up in price since more and more metal is being found every day... People need to understand that metal is devaluing.

It really isn't otherwise items priced in metal would go up at the same time. Also, look at the bright side. As the key goes up, items priced in keys are going down every day. It may cost more to get a key but the key buys more than it used to.

I don't think the rise it justified when it comes to its speed. Yes, as more metal comes in, the price should go up. I understand this.

But, I don't think enough metal is being made to justify the speed in which these keys are rising.

If we use the argument made here, then keys should be 20 ref at one point, because it seems that "enough metal" is being magically made (kind of is) every week or so to justify its rise. In the past, every so often, the price of keys went up every couple months or so, by a scrap. Why? Because as you said, more metal.

I do believe that the price should go up, but not at the speed in which it has had since Halloween. This is total madness. I hate to sound like a cliche angry mob, but this somewhat comes down to greedy sellers or whatever you want to call them. People only have two/three choices, buy the keys with their metal, buy from the store, or buy from the market place. Most people cannot really afford to use their real money when it comes to this, so they have to pay up the prices set by others on the market in ref. Kind of depressing. :(

U missed what I am saying. Metal isn't the reason for key trade price increase. Demand is. Metal has good buying power. If it didn't than the items like Genuines/Vintages would have been going up in price this whole time. Look at the items that r priced in keys. Teufort kickers were 2 keys a few months ago but now under 4 ref. Look at the 20 highest priced stranges. Two r increasing, one is not changing and the other 17 have dropped recently.

The strange huntsman, just 1 month ago, was 11 keys and is now 6 keys. Its lowest price ever.

Also, of all the items priced in keys, Long218 is responsible for bringing the price down on them over 50 times just in the last 3 weeks alone. You can complain about his key suggestions but he has done a huge amount of work making many things cheaper also.

To be honest, I am tired of hearing anything to do with Long. Good comments and bad comments alike are said about him. I am just tired of hearing about the guy. xD

Hey guys....why don't we CREATE a NEW tf2 PRICELIST page and a NEW tf2 TRADING site without the highballer and quick sell price bullshit

its called trade.tf

I know such a site, it's called: backpack.tf.

Quick sales are not valid proof.

Highballs... they don't sell easily, no valid proof either. (that's why they are called "highballs")

Kill me now

You had a trade ban and a private bp, why the fuck are you still here

He has over 600 keys and wants profit and doesn't care about ruining the economy of the rest of us... that's why.. The reason keys are not 2.33 refined anymore is because of people like Long, people turning TF2 into Wall Street

He is trade benned he cannot trade those 600 keys anyways...Dont make yourself look stupid please

I repeat what I said earlier, how do we know he doesn't have an alt account with another 600 that he CAN trade/sell?

You mean he "was" trade banned

If this suggestion got accepted again, I'll really grab a shotgun to kill myself...

Your life is so sad you'd kill your self over a key going up in price... go outside.

Seriously?

Hilarious.

I want to know what it feels like to want to kill yourself over a $0.02 suggested change in key prices. Not saying I agree with this suggestion, just that you need to go experience life a little more if you would joke about killing yourself over something as small as this.

Do you think I'm really joking around here? I'd really go kill myself if this suggestion gets accepted again because I'm enjoying play more games than trading, and if you are talking about your OWN experience about life, kindly please don't say it in front of my face, 'cause I have my own...

Yo dawg i herd you liek jokes so you made a joke on a joke XD

to be honest, i actually think that his range is acceptable. i have people on trade servers buying for 5 refs. almost all that sell would not go below that

Proof or counterproof, rules are the same: please provide screenshots/proof.

Hey guise let's just use TF2Finance as a source :3

Cause, ya know, finance is totally right and stuff. :3

:3 :3 :3 :3 :3

*Honk honk*

Why would you raise it by a scrap?

try buying a key for 4.77 refs see how that works out for you :)

Because people aren't greedy? Those links can be used to prove people AREN'T greedy and 4.77 is possible.

http://www.tf2outpost.com/trade/10541252 4.66

http://www.tf2outpost.com/trade/10539630 4 @ 4.77

http://www.tf2outpost.com/trade/10539541 4.66

http://www.tf2outpost.com/trade/10537409 6 @ 4.77

http://www.tf2outpost.com/trade/10537400 4.66

http://www.tf2outpost.com/trade/10536784 4.66

http://www.tf2outpost.com/trade/10536700 4.66

http://www.tf2outpost.com/trade/10531093 4.66

http://www.tf2outpost.com/trade/10528617 4.66

http://www.tf2outpost.com/trade/10525822 4.66

http://www.tf2outpost.com/trade/10524925 3 @ 4.33

http://www.tf2outpost.com/trade/10524451 4.33

http://www.tf2outpost.com/trade/10522251 3 @ 4.77

http://www.tf2outpost.com/trade/10521777 4.66

I might add to your post whenever I find any too :)

http://www.tf2outpost.com/trade/10543607 - 4.77

Quick trade

Either trying to prove a point or needed the metal

Quick trade

Doesn't put a comment, probably oblivious to price or quicksell

Ok I'll give you that one

And that one is good too

This one is good too, don't understand why he put 1:6 though

He's trying to prove a point

Probably needed the metal

Mentally challenged?

Quick trade

I don't even know where you find all these

Seriously I want to buy keys for this much

people are WILLING to sell for this price. doesnt matter how quickly it sells, matters how many are sold

Despite quicksells being a statistical anomaly, not usually counted in price suggestions.

enough people are selling at that, it should be included

http://www.tf2outpost.com/trade/10549101 (4)

http://www.tf2outpost.com/trade/10548895 (2 ref hat)

Yes.

first link, just another loner's attempt to bring down the price

second link is for item. so yea, doesn't count.

http://www.tf2outpost.com/trade/10562331 - seller @ 4 ref

I added him right when he open the trade but he ignored me.

probly troll.

Wasn't spamming Suggestions against rules?

SPAM SPAM SPAM SPAM SPAM SPAM SPAM SPAM SPAM

price manipulator pls go

How's that relevant to this suggestion?

It's a joke on how many people are not using TF2Finance anymore/don't trust it because it's just somewhat not trustworthy at the moment.

Or something.

Tl;dr don't use Finance. Community hates it.

I think you posted it on a wrong place :-)

Not really. Quite a lot of people have taken to not using TF2Finance as proof anymore because they believe it's easy to be manipulated (I mean, from the suggestion you can still find several keys for way below what finance is at) and I'm pointing out that he's using it.

> way below

Just because the average is higher than your minimum doesn't imply the average if false.

Same reason you won't say that the IQ score is faulty just because you find someone with 90 IQ and call the national average of 100 "manipulated".

Nobody is denying that 4.66 is happening while average is 5.

I have to agree with Baloo, with scrap.tf buying 100+ a day at 4.77, it still needs to be in the range.

100+ a day? and yet no keys are available for sale ever.

people willing to pay more for 24/7 bots with fast respond time and no trouble with haggling or w/e.

just like people willing to sell keys for less toward online users or users with lot of rep.

Really? Are you back??

i don't like those new prices, i just hope they drop again

http://backpack.tf/vote/id/5182d319ba2536bd77000003

his old trade didnt go to well.

why post again...

Majority of us don't want key prices to raise because they already are inflated.

I must ask you guys a question... erm

how does it happen that we all HATE that suggestion, and ewryone downvotes it

but i bet its gonna be accepted anyways?

I don't know why voting is pointless to admins on every inflating key suggestions....

It is pointless because the proof there, but people dont want keys to go up so just downvote for no good reason

People downvote because they don't want the price to go up, but it gets accepted because there is good proof for the price to rise. The admins are unbiased (or supposed to be) towards the price, looking solely at the facts.

What a coincidence his BP is private so we can't see the shit ton of keys he owns and is trying to inflate!

He is trade banned so he can't trade those keys anyways, please get your info correct before insulting someone. Thanks

Again, he doesn't care about the trade price. He sells on paypal.

I'd give him a Direct Hit for the keys, but I no longer have one :'c

wooooo a key suggestion, lets grab some popcorn and watch

all the noobs be mad.

this key suggestions is made up of three components

long: trolololololol tf2finance wins

admin: you have been WARNED!!!!

ramses: how is this relevent

reading how everyones jimmies are rustled is hilarious.

Finally, a decent key suggestion. People need to learn the difference between the price they want and the real price, once again well done Long.

Btw, when using sarcasm please say /s/

Sarcasm? What was sarcastic about that. This is a very accurate suggestion. THe low end of keys is 4.88 (and even that's near impossible to find) and the high end may be a little more, but we are discounting both the quicksellers and the overpriced sellers as they are rarer, compared to the common price of 5/5.11. And the reason people downvoted my comment (and this one) is because the truth hurts. Who cares if you want to buy a key for 2.66 ref? That's not what the market value is. The market value is what the sellers dictate, and that isn't relying on the backpack.tf prices anymore. The traders are taking it into their own hands because backpack isn't updating the price to what it actually is. Now the market is entirely dictated by sellers, so what you "feel" the price should be is irrelevant. Look down a few comments at what Para and Demopan said, because I am 100% agreed with them. Come at me with the dislikes, TF2 traders with your head in your arse.

Btw, when using sarcasm please say /s/

Guys please continue. I shall get the popcorn.

Just no, again. Stop spamming this.

I hate keys now.

If I see another key suggestion in the next 24 hours, I'm gonna cry... I'm already tearing up right now ;~;

Private backpack... Seems legit

Can you stop with the key suggestions for one damn day?

I been dropping for 3 weeks...

I meant, everyone. It is getting annoying to see a new key suggestion each day.

Owns 624 keys ... lol greed

Except that he's trade banned and can't do shit with them.

More reason he shouldn't be able to do this. xD

There was no suggestion for 2 days new record!

I have literally been trying to buy keys for 5 ref, and I get but one add a day. If it was max, then I'm sure I would get a flocking towards me. And the never sell in bulk, only one at a time. The lower end is near impossible. upvoted

Trade Servers mate. There are plenty of people selling for 4.88 - 5 refined. More towards the 5 refined end. But still.

one scrap difference so you want to jump servers and kill time...

Long keeps spamming suggestions nobody beside 2-3 people like. But apparently he is allowed to spam them without getting punished at all. So i bet he is also allowed to make another suggestion right after this is accepted, huh? Well, guess LOIC has to take down this site either.

He hasnt made a single key suggestion for the past few weeks tho...

That doesnt mean that he is allowed to keep spamming over and over new suggestions when his previous one was just closed 3 hours ago.

Why does 1 scrap make such a big fuckin difference

Well it's because after 1 scrap it'll be another scrap, and another, and another etc. etc. The total difference right now is about 2.55 ref (and that IS a big difference).

I think we all need to calm the shiznit down and just wait for the key market to crash and let the same thing repeat itself again, sounds like excellent Capitalism to me...bloody...brilliant! Also can someone please ban the fuck out of Long so he stops spamming the key suggestions, when did he even last play the goddamn game? Trading is really a catch 22.

If he doesn't make the suggestions, somebody else will. Long is just faster than everyone else. He's reporting what the prices are, right? That's what this section of backpack.tf is for.

What's more, you're on a website pretty much dedicated to the assistance of trading, and you're complaining about him not playing the game.

inb4 -15 because i'm not bursting blood vessels over long218 making a key suggestion

I agree the key prices are 'fair' and mirror with current trading but why is he doing it so often? I'm not bursting blood vessels, I personally think the whole affair is hilarious and am just waiting to see it all some tumbling down, the higher something gets the harder it falls. I personally think Long is just doing it to f£*k with everyone and as some have said 'watch the world burn'. Now I don't think that is the kind of person we want in a trading community.

because I was the first one to be brave enough to not quit suggesting key suggestion after the first time.

because you know, once you have an accepted key suggestion, you get a lot of hate.

I'm just being a scapegoat so that no one have to take the hate beside me.

Well that's what you chose to do and have to deal with, not my problem.

im just answering your freaking question.

Yes I was answering to your answer. I do find the use of the word brave a bit unnecessary to use on the internet, we're all such brave keyboard warriors eh? But why Long do YOU want to update the key prices, please tell all of us because if you hardly play the game or trade anymore and are 'retired' as your name suggests, why would you care about the price of an item in said game.

First amendment.

Why do I have to explain to you why do I care to explain my action ?

Because you don't play the game and are still changing it, is that fair that you should be influencing something that doesn't really affect you. You should let the people that play and trade decide how their community and game is changed and adapted. Just tell us why, perhaps your reason could rid of some of the hate you have accumulated, if you don't say then we're all just going to keep on assuming it's something sinister and just for you own gain.

You were not brave. You were simply seeking retaliation for the punishment you received. Trying to drive the price of keys up so far that metal becomes trash as your final gambit after being trade banned.

lol

my very first key suggestion dated as far back as 3 refined. so

Some people just want to watch the world burn.

It's funny to watch noobs cry ;(

Backpack.tf is becoming less reputable everyday last 2 suggestions. -170 and -871 votes were passed even though enough counter evidence was given. This is obviously negligence by corrupt admins.

http://backpack.tf/vote/id/517edf29ba25369d6500000c the suggestion that was accepted with -871, "even though enough counter evidence was given.", i couldn't find any counter proof at all. But you know what's funny? There were like 5 other people that provided extra proof ^_^

On the last suggestion, there were SOME valid counterproof from the OtherChigga. The counter proof from sitebender was just unsuccesful buyers which didn't prove anything, and the other was just the links from the suggestion for 4.66-5 which was outdated, so also wasn't valid proof. SO in conlcusion, no there were not nearly enough counterproof, to counter the mass amount of buyers at 5 ref

most people voted with their emotionals and not looking at the proof.

^exactly, which is why the mods ignored the votes

oh man,I miss the good old days where people bought and sold keys at 2.55 ref. the prices today are real pure shit.

Pepperridge Farm remembers

Just go die in a hole.

classy.

I know, rite?

I'm with long on this one, the things he does are shit but telling someone to kill themselves over prices in a virtual game is fuckign retarded

How can you cash out if you can't trade?

When in doubt spam it out:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=anwy2MPT5RE

2.33 is good price for Key.

I'll buy yours

Does anyone else find this suspicious

yeah mattje is probably a scammer

yea he pay only 2.22 and a weapon

what a greedy outpost user

this is no really enough but help

http://www.tf2outpost.com/trade/10505031

stop making key suggestions you piece of turd

*scroll* *scroll* *scroll* *scroll*

I can't take seriously the suggestion of a guy who owns 642 Keys, AND is cashing out. That being said, I haven't bought any keys since they started going up. I've only bought 3 from a guy that was selling them at 4.66 two weeks ago, and bought 6 more, that were uploaded by Sneeza to TF2shop at a price of U$S1.69ish.

I'm not paying any of you greedy f#ckers more than 4.66 for a key, that is my limit and I hope many others do the same so you all end up either lowering the price or shoving your 600 keys you-know-where. I'd rather go ahead and pay U$S2.50 for a key on the Mann Co. store, at least I know that money will help the game development and is not going to the pockets of people who don't even care about the game.

great speech.

too bad no one cares about your limit, or that you want to pay $2.5.

You both need to calm down. -_-

Now how's that helpful to this suggestion?

You are my hero. Thanks for taking your time. At least it gets 1 scrap less :D Nice job you done there.

dafuq, the price goes up. It will be one scrap MORE

PLEASE

THOSE ARE PROFITS TRADES

And you own 642 keys!

Isn't that the point of trading? For profit? And he can't do shit with those keys, so that's irrelevant.

You guys know your screwing you self over whit this.

look mabye the value of you backpack increes

mabye you will get more ref for it

but you forgot about one little point its called The rest

Keys price rise the rest all items of tf2 will fall.

look buds no are 21-22 keys they were 25-26 keys 1 week or 2 weeks ago You guys dont get it if we will keep rising the price of the keys you guys whit many keys will kill your own buisness cause nobody will buy them anymore if it like 6 ref cause THAT IS MADNESS!

I hope you guys will see the light

Have a nice day

-Doctor Cake

It's going to come down at some point. Just let it keep rising, there really is nothing anyone can do to stop the rise right now, the only way its actually gonna stop is after it reaches the point where people refuse to buy it, causing the sellers to lower their price.

people can't refuse to pay something with a currency that is free and easy to get

More and more people want the price to go down. When keys were at 4 ref, there were much more sellers and buyers compared to now.

It currently takes more than 3 months just to collect enough metal to buy one key with one account. Time is a factor that must be considered; at one point, buyers will not have the patience to wait that long. So yeah, metal might be free (It's not, look at your electric bill) and easy to get, but it's a time consumer with just one account and some don't want to idle and just have fun.

Enough of of the bullshit we need no more damn key overprices!

in the near future as well, will be more worthwhile to spend money on tf2 store.

Valve will be pleased ($_$)

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pZaY1jV96jI

Still impressed by that "Normal" Key.

Damn, most users on this site are turning to complete shit. Is it a coincidence that the suggestion to lower key prices is the only one with a positive score? Most of you don't give a shit about whether or not there is adequate proof for the suggested price. And your constant bitching on these suggestions apply pressure to the admins to not accept them, because it will only worsen the reputation of backpack.tf. I'm probably going to get a load of downvotes for this, since you seem to blindly downvote any comment that raises negativity towards what you want to see, even though the comment might raise valid concerns.

I agree with you, most people on backpack.tf are just people

like this

No. Long, you can fuck off for real now. Nobody likes you. You probably bribe the admins into accepting this bullshit.

Shadoo · posted 7 minutes ago · Score: 0

The proof is all there the range is accurate. and he's showing succesfull sales at 5.11 ref+. and buyers at higher at current range. people just don't like keys rising. so they hate and hate

How in the name of god can you not realize Long cannot trade any of his keys, and is only suggesting prices to go up literally only to be an asshole?

Read this. http://i.imgur.com/MI9HryY.jpg

I know he can't trade his keys. this price is actually accurate. look at the suggestion and proof don't look at the person rasing the keys.

And do you know why he can't trade?

Because he's TRADE BANNED.

You know, for buying carded keys. Which means he shouldn't be able to roam around this site freely, but no, you just HAVE to let him make these suggestions....for what reason?

And do you know why he can't trade?

Because he's TRADE BANNED.

<Nothing to do with SR. he's trade restricted. so he's not a marked scammer or tagged as trade banned by valve. he's still able to make suggestions.

You know, for buying carded keys. Which means he shouldn't be able to roam around this site freely, but no, you just HAVE to let him make these suggestions....for what reason?

<If it's accurate let him do it. if he was trolling this would be closed right now.

Maybe he ISN'T trolling, but you sure as hell aren't closing these suggestions because of the hundreds of downvotes like you should be doing.

If the suggestion was passed based on votes keys would be 2.33 when actual sales are happening at 5+ refined

Just go away

Who are the bastards letting these outrageous prices go through? Highballers? Admins?

Can we just stop with this shit and rewind back to last year when they were being sold for 2.66? I just want to buy virtual keys with my virtual money.

99 problems but a bi*ch ain't one

Like i said before an admin deleted my comment, bribing the admins.

lol

Obviously your only response is "lol," you've got admins on your side to accept this sh!t even when it gets downvoted to hell.

that's not true

even chief shoe said he has had enough of long

lack of vincent isn't on his side he actually banned him for trolling before. he's enforcing. and vincent as well said he doesn't "like" long very much anymore

So i'll say it again.

Why does every admin keep accepting these suggestions even when the amount of downvotes far surpasses the upvotes?

Is this site not supposed to be community driven?

when people like you downvote just because it's long or their raising the price of keys. votes from people like you don't count

I don't vote on key suggestions

And how does your magical computer track hundreds of downvotes like these?

also how it tracks what people downvoted for and exactly for what reason?

from the idiotic comments

And what if comments aren't posted?

What the hell kind of reason is that, anyway?

Regardless, we are allowed to vote, and just bringing up a bullshit excuse like "well those dont count lol" is like giving people a choice to bet on two Spies who are Spycrabbing, and even if someone won the bet their bet won't count because "they didnt bet the right items lol"

You take a good look at the proof (from previous accepted suggestion).

The proof was good. And therefore, the suggestion got accepted.

And for the 14922th time: most people vote what they want, they don't care about the proof and/or providing counterproof.

If the mods accepted/declined every suggestion because of the votes only, it would become the new spreadshit fast, because it's basically price manipulation.

For further discussion: http://forums.backpack.tf/index.php?/topic/641-yet-another-key-price-topic-no-flame-wars-please-discussion-only/

Pretty sure most of the admins don't like Long :)

Sure they don't like Long, i got that idea already. But they don't seem to mind having the prices get jacked up for their own needs.

So, you're implying that anyone who makes a key suggestion is bribing admins?

Welcome to Valve's backpack.tf

Technically, yes, they're bribing admins with the chance of letting them sell their keys for higher, which obviously they take every time.

They're bribing a hell of a lot more people then admins

Lol because it is not deleted......

Btw, you were "warned" most likely for foul language, nothing to do with the admin bribe statement

Shuddup you, shouldn't you CASHED OUT

and like every time a lot of jimmies get rustled

Of course you're okay with this, you have 150 keys in your backpack.

And how do we know you didn't just say that because you have 0..?

Because for one, i can't buy keys with money because i don't have any at the moment, and two, i'm not buying keys with ref because of suggestions like these.

:________(

your point being?

Just a scrap...

Why are you being so shy? Make It 10 ref you got my upvote.

:D -1

Someone doesn't get the joke.

the moment that Long gets unbanned from key suggestions; boom, suggestion.

I got unbanned since last saturday mate.

I know, and when you got unbanned; boom, suggestion

Should I just kill myself and get it over with?

First, you need to get a life. Your life has no value in the real world at the moment.

only thing that matters is our bp, welcome to tf2, enjoy your stay.

I love how serious people took that comment.

Can I get a clarification on something? It seem to be the opening post means that people trying to sell quickly by offering low prices should be ignored, but people offering to pay above the norm to make it happen fast should be taken into account. That doesn't really make much sense to me.

Basically some people who are selling under the market price to get some quick metal, eg scrap.tf buying promos a few keys under price to traders that want quick metal and dont want to wait for it to be sold at normal price.

so it should be ignored, ie ill sell a craft hat @ 1 ref doesnt make it one ref if i have 20 adds in 5 mins right?

To answer your 2nd question ill use an example. If the market price is 2 refs and you have alot of people opening trades going "buying at 3 refs", it means alot of people are willing to buy at a higher price so the price needs to be updated. why would people sell at 2 refs if you can easily get 3 refs right?

I like how everyone is disliking my comment for answering a question and trying to help a fellow trader lolol

There ARE higher key trades happening that are being fully ignored. 5.22 sellers tend to be rather successful, but are ignored for key suggestions. Traders even manage to succeed selling at 5.33 refined. Similarly, ignored for key suggestions. The only reason they're not brought up to begin with is that backpack.tf has been focusing purely on buyer trades for key suggestions.

Though for me, I don't like defining key quicksells in terms of 'speed'. Keys don't really work well there. They either go nigh-instantly or at a painstaking crawl, with no real in between For me, it's a matter of 'could they have gotten more by not making a trade at all and instead looking at highly available buyer trades'. As an example, if someone posts a trade to sell a key for 4 refined when they could have searched refined->keys and found several dozen people all ready and willing to buy for 4.77 refined or higher within the past 2 minutes of trades, that to me is a key quicksell.

this will get accepted no matter what... dont waste your time looking for counter proof because no one cares. even downvoting wouldnt help...

I can bet everything I got that this will get accepted

Lol his previous one was rejected for your information because of somewhat proper/legit counter proof.

If you're telling people not to try counter it dont complain if it gets accepted.

Please dont fill out bp with your ignorant comments. Thanks.

???

Score: -170

Accepted 2 days ago

Score: -871

Accepted 4 days ago

http://backpack.tf/vote/id/5182d319ba2536bd77000003

I was referring to this one, as you suggest that all key suggests are accepted.

Thats why if you're going to downvote/argue back you'll need proof :)

That's backpack.tf for you, shitty admins who run this corrupt site

again voting on key suggestions arnt considered because everyone is biased, you could open a suggestion with keys going 2.66 refs with no proof and you'll get a heap of upvotes.

why would people sell for 4.66 refs when you can instantly sell for 5 refs right? :L

Then please leave this place. You shall not be missed.

Where the hell is that economist that Robin hired?

He's already working his magic on backpack.tf

Just accept his suggestion, how many people are still selling under 5 ref? Wow.

The only reason people are constantly increasing the prices of keys is because of this little cycle:

1. Highballer sells keys for 5.33

2. Average trader obtains a key; might as well get the most of it and sell for market price.

3. Backpack.tf admins accept increased price because of the overwhelming "evidence"

4. Highballer starts selling for 5.44

5. Rinse and repeat

Get your shit together, admins. Nobody should have to pay ridiculous amounts of metal for a more compact and desired currency (seriously, if you are even thinking about uncrating you are so fucking rich the key prices don't even affect you). TF2 would be better off without these key prices.

http://tf2finance.com/2012_11/ <--- read this

Backpack.tf staggered around 4.33 refs for around a week and a bit when long was banned from keys and admins couldn't accept half ass key suggestions, and keys were being sold near the 5 ref mark already. conclusion: bp doesnt have as much influence as you would think,

Keys have been going up because refine has been going down, keys are always and forever will be 2.5$ from steam (only way to get it) where as metal is free(you play you get it). So you have a crap load of metal from alot of players and keys need to be bought...etc naturally metal goes down in price.

Idlers that use sandbox to get 25ref/week dont care a=how much they pay using their "free" metal because they buy keys, and sell it off for real money. steam market also has alot of keys going out of the market too.

Again, metal has been dropping and the price of keys is always 2.5$, keys hasnt risen at all!

If this makes you angry, why not quit?

It always has been Valve's plan to devalue any value left in metals to nothing.

Seriously, Who's idiot will make the price go up high?

these prices will go so high the the people will have to buy at the store.

Pls have pity on poor traders and lower the price of keys.

that is what steam wants so they get more money >:

steam is a b*tch

waii, cant we vote to lower? D:

Has anyone else noticed that now that Long is back, Hatch has been awfully quiet?

Hatch is my alt.

lets see what he has to say about that

False.

1. If you were telling the truth, then you would be able to back it up by posting that same thing on this account.

2. I've made suggestions. You take every opportunity to get more precious reputation. You wouldn't waste time on this account making suggestions when you could be getting even more rep for your main account.

3. I speak English better than you.

4. I've disagreed with you in the past. Unless you were truly a sad little troll, then you wouldn't spend time arguing with yourself on the internet.

5. I bought a medic taunt off you one time: http://i.imgur.com/fW1nJnd.png?1 Why would your alt buy anything from you?

Or you're just purposely making evidence for an excuse and you really are Long.

I'm on to you...

>600+ keys

* screams internally *

As stated many times before, he cannot do anything with the keys as he is trade banned

YOU ALL ARE IDIOTS.People dont want to sell for backpack price,people on backplack see it and make new Price Suggestion!STOP THIS MADNESS!

WHY ARE YOU RESPONDING TO MY COMMENT srsly make your own comment, you are not arguing against my comment. Also looking at your comment, Isn't that the point of changing the price, people successfully selling for a higher price, so we make a new suggestion for a higher price?

Sory about dat mate

Glory to the day that long218 is banned forever, and Yanis himself comes down from his pile of golden pixels to strike Long down himself.

Why are people making suggestions that ranges but doesn't change the max price?Everyone sells TF2 prices at the max. price of the backpack price.Example:If a hat is 3.66-4 ref on backpack,every single one sells it for 4 ref.I almost have never seen someone selling it at the minimum price.I just think it doesn't make sense to suggest a price if you're not gonna change the maximum one.

Max price typically equals what people successfully sell for, and min price what people successfully buy for.

Why would you want keys to go up if you cannot trade?

For accuracy?

I hate so many of the babies on this site. Good on you for doing that research, long, good on the admins for accepting past suggestions even though the little kids are selfish and can't acknowledge the clear increase in price.

Are we seriously going to let one guy destroy the economy just so he can rasie his bp value as much as possible? Fuck that, downvote.

Is there not enough proof that the suggestion is accurate? Because I see quite a lot.

You're an idiot. Proof doesn't mean shit on this site anyways. The dumbass admins are the ones who decide the final price anyways, which is why you see key votes with -871 votes passing.

.....because they have enough proof.

Jesus christ, the amount of butthurt in this thread is outstanding. They need to start banning people for making comments irrelevant to the suggestion.

keys should rise to 5-5.33 ref

Mann Co. Supply Crate Key

VOTING (1856)

? TALK

404 NEW<=====================

4.88–5.11 ref CURRENT

4.77–5.11 ref OWNS

642

Posted 1 day ago by ★ ☣Long218 #yolo420blazeit ♫

First of all, why would sales that go in literally seconds should be use as counter proof ? Wouldn't that make them a quicksell which should never be …More

404 comments now the 405th

404 is some error code

People, why don't we start increasing the prices of Dota 2 instead?

If long deleted all his keys and made a suggestion to upvote the key prices, would he get attacked less?

What can you do with keys that you can't even trade?

PS. Good proof, upvoted

The suggestor owns 650 keys. So its fair to say he could give some away for people to trade at this apparent new cost there suggesting. Never thought id see a vote for increase in key price from someone who has 650 in there backpack. well i never. Seen it all now!

If you think 650 is a lot then http://backpack.tf/vote/id/513f98eeba25366418000006

itt: people who are butthurt that they can't afford keys and like ignoring large amounts of proof, while thinking that downvoting a suggestion makes the price go down.

4.77ref for one key, the only trade with no response...so i agree

http://www.tf2outpost.com/trade/10530195

This is a good deal as there is a middle price and a low and a high.

it makes it fair to sell.

Well it seems pointless downvoting seeing as it won't make a blind bit of difference whether this suggestion is closed or not, fucking price manipulating admins.

Amen to that

manipulating price with proof.

the new level of manipulation.

Proof is irrelavent as they are only selling because of the price on here, so proof is meaningless. It's what people want the price to be that counts, and right now, nobody wants the price this high, do the admins care? Nope - price manipulating bastards.

HAHAHHAHAHA

HAHAHAHHAHA

HAHAHHAA

that is the most hilarious and stupid thing I heard today.

explain how when key drop to 4.66, price didn't keep dropping but instead people still paying more thus making the 4.77-5.11 suggestion passed ?

Yeah sure, and because the only people selling keys always pay more than the market price, that doesn't mean the majority don't want the price to be lower which as I said before is never taken into acount, there's nothing "hilarious" about it.

Wow... someone ban this Long guy. He's still at it? Even with his locked down BP

Prediction:

On a self-proclaimed 'community vote based' pricelist, one person will consider the opinions of a 3-digit-number of downvoters less relevant and more biased than his own, and decide to pass yet another raise in the value of an item he happens to own over 600 copies of.

Proof? You don't need proof. It's about keys, supply and demand does not apply to keys.

They are sold for whatever their backpack.tf value is. Whatever number you might pick, the suggestion will easily proof itself.

That being said, I upvoted this.

I have 7 keys and I want my backpack to rise in value. That's how it's meant to be done, no?

1) votes on keys mean next to nothing because everyone is biased, open a suggestion for keys to be 1 ref with no proof and you'll still get alot of upvotes.

2) bp.tf staggered around 4.33 refs when long was banned and there were no decent proof on key suggestions. Outpost had already started trading keys at the 5 ref mark, tf doesnt have as much influence as you would think. Keys go up whether you like it or not

3) i think long is trade banned so he cant trade his 642 keys anyways lol

About the third answer...

http://steamrep.com/profiles/76561198042823837

I don't see any banned by valve tag, only a caution tag on reddit.

http://steamcommunity.com/id/long218/

Nor anything that says that his trade status is on a probation. Someone explain to me why he can't trade when he doesn't have the tag.

Valve tags take time to show up on the profile, although the effect of not being able to trade is immediate.

and lets not skip the fact that you are rising the key price to 1.75$

when everyone sells for 1.5-1.6 with very low succes rates

http://forums.sourceop.com/threads/142381-TF2-Keys-for-1-59-WMZ-WMR-WME-Webmoney?s=c2e2e630a4b09470676ec39bc6985a9f

lol.

low success rates ?

if so why do people willing to pay a lot for keys

http://www.tf2outpost.com/trade/9154730 this guy is buying key at $1.6(tf2outpost mod)

http://www.reddit.com/r/tf2trade/comments/1dp488/hpaypal_wkeys_at_180/ $1.8

http://redd.it/1djr3a

http://redd.it/1dj23i

http://redd.it/1diux6

http://redd.it/1dp488

http://www.tf2outpost.com/trade/10220075 1.7

someone mus give them the source rep links

sellers sell for way fewer $ there

outpost is for desperate situations when you need some fast keys to invest on something ..

nevertheless i dont know why someone pays with real mone for a key or why they pay that much ref for a key

steam market gives you more choices

and flexibility to your trades

keys are overpriced

every marketable item is as good as keys

keys are only for exceptional purchase and uncrates.

but still its a tool and nothing more.

if i need a key i sell a hat

i dont buy it..

my conclusion is to many awfull traders out there with wrong feel of priority

a guy sold me his mining light for 1 key wtf?

i sold it in 5 second for 3.18 euro

people are misslead about the actual value of their items

the dont take steam market as serius as they should

lucky me i am buying precius hats with precius paints for useless keys

what to say people are born victims

i dont say keys aint't rissing i am saying that this is not the actual rate they does

one link is the most you could found ?

and you do know people are willing to sell for less on different form of payment method because it is less popular right ?

long your backpack is suspicious your trading history is full of quicksells

its only natural not to want quicksells to be reflected in prices.

you know that as well as i do

it is our best interest for people to think that keys are never ending rise in price

suites our purposes

the truth you dont tell them is that we buy them cheaper we just skip that part.

yawn

how does this even related to our conversation ?

personally bought 4 at 4.77 6 at 4.88 since yesterday 2 for 4.66

since yesterday.

we need to include quicksellers in the range

pics or didn't happen.

and 4.88 is in the range.

well i am not going to support a lower range with proofs.

not in my interests

your low end is 1 scrap above in my opinion but it will be up to date when this get accepted so i guess its fine.

the high range seems low according to tf2 op

but then again i dont care either

i have no problem with you ranges i just want to see quicksellers in it eventually.

i mean at 4.66 and 4.77.

so proof yes or no ?

proofs and knowledge is something i use for my trades and i dont share them..so yes whatever.. those trades never happened.

is that an excuse for lying about you bought keys at 4.66 ?

wow this guy RELAY wants to higher the key price, is this even allowed to suggest 1 thing over and over and over again.

Check your language.

you're not my dad!!1111111111

That's irrelevant. Watch your tongue, you are breaking site rules.

Ok :'( sorry

buying keys for 5 ref add me

This is pretty much why the only reason I don't vote on backpack.tf suggestions.

I only use this site to look at the ads and my backpack value.

In my opinion, keys should be just 5 ref on average, no need for hate.

Now, time for me to play some Skyrim, a game that is better than the TF2 economy.

All this drama... over a technical 1.60 us dollars (Yes, I know that's not usually the case, let me have my moment :c)

Anyway, I have seen a decent amount of people sell the keys a little cheaper than the range (Take it as a salt grain, I don't have any proof, feel free to make of it what you will.) so, sorry Long, down vote. And, mind me asking, why do you keep suggesting when you can't sell these keys anymore (Or can you? I am a little out of the loop so I can't be sure.) Anyway, there's my 2 cents on it, back to the all-out text-chat war.

Yeah that $1.60 - $1.80 goes a long way in Russia.

i suggest lovering key to 4 ref and then all would be happy :D

>lovering

I was thinking 2.69 1,371,000 ref / 510,000 keys = 2.69 ref. But that's not how it works.

TF2wh just upped its keys from 4.44 to 5 ref. I wonder if this will cause a rise overall.

it'll also cause a crash as well. :P

<3 kittens!

yey kitties

R.I.P TF2 Trading.

>Knowingly traded with carders

>Was trade banned

>Attempts to reduce price of almost everything except keys

>Always has hundreds of keys

>Constantly trying to raise keys

>Obviously an extremely bias motive here

bp.tf accepts his suggestions

"look at me, i can make ad hominems and ignore the proof he's giving! i'm saving keys!"

haters try to find unrelated reasons to attack.

No wonder he wants the price to go up he has 642 keys :/

He's trade banned, so he can't gain any profit.

Can someone just put a gun to my head so I can't witness all this?

In all the long winded discussions we have on spuf, it mostly boils down to backpack.tf/long upvoting key prices for nefarious but never explained reasons.

I'd like to hear these reasons now. Because generally where there's a criminal conspiracy, someones making money...

I'll spell out the most basic ones off the top of my head.

Rich trader sells keys for 5 ref, buys a pile of craft hats, sells them for no profit = profit?

Rich trader with idles buys keys for 5 ref, sells keys for 5 ref, buys keys again for 6 ref later on, all the while watching his farm grow less effective = profit?

Rich trader spends his cash, buys as many keys as he can, sells them for 5 ref, hoards refs like crazy = profit?

Rich trader turns all his keys into metal, crafts like crazy so he can have his name spread far and wide across tf2 land because all his items are now tagged as crafted by him = profit?

As far as I've figured out, the only people who benefit from this key issue are newbies. Newbies join tf2, go premium, buying two keys, now you have 10 ref to fill your previously empty backpack with items, a hell of a jump start into tf2.

So basically backpack.tf is behind a huge conspiracy to help out newbies joining tf2?

Theres a limit to how much ref anyone needs, any "rich" tf2 player has very little use for it, all their items are keys or buds or more, so wheres the profit?

From http://forums.steampowered.com/forums/showthread.php?t=3118340

Encourages real money trading. Which drives the dollar value of keys up. Also keeps newbie traders out, which makes it more of a monopoly

God Damnit Long just retire people are getting tired of these economic key rises

http://imgur.com/a/t71sl

We need a better spreadshit D:

yea because people gonna listen to what the public decide the price is.

cuz you know, past history of governments run by only the ordinary people like that worked very well.

Coming from a selfish,asshole, it's pretty amusing.

called me selfish for reflecting the correct price.

http://i40.tinypic.com/3515mzc.jpg

Take that, bitch.

Once again, the comments are the most exciting part of these suggestions.

True that

So lets see one of the most famous "wash and repeat" bp.tfers is raising the price of keys for they're direct personal gain AGIAN really what has this website become more than a stale repetitive show of greed and ill gotten profit that destroys the backacks of new players and no currency hoarders alike

explain how someone can make profit with higher key prices

I own an item. My item has just increased in value. I can sell my item for higher than it's initial price. Seriously, it's not that hard.

what do I do with 5 ref?

everyone would prefer a key instead of 5 ref

You can buy a hat for 1.33.

and then...

This is getting out of control... What happens when the robo keys come out? Will they be going for slightly more than the regular ones like usual? Not as many people are going to unbox if the new keys are so much, and not as many people unboxing is going to drive the new items up in price... It's getting really expensive if this keeps up.

Who gives a crap its gonna go up anyways

selled some keys at 5.66

http://www.tf2outpost.com/trade/10554201#/36373338

Sold*

Why do people not understand you are making yourself pay more, its not like you make money because keys go up. Greedy bastards!

Why don't just ignore all the evidence and switch back to 2.66 when everyone was happy?

Because most traders would continue to sell at 5+ Ref. Reverting the price back to 2.66 would result in one thing, and one thing only, a bunch of newer traders selling keys at 2.66 ref ad getting ripped off. And then people would just accuse bptf of manipulating key prices in the other direction and it would be the same problem, only worse since theres no proof to support a price of 2.66 ref.

I remember when I could barely sell for 3 ref. Now that'd be too easy :(

How dahell's 4.88 still possibru ?

>trade banned

>username still implies cashing out

I'm not seeing the logic here.

This vote has waited so long. Keys are almost non-existent at even 4.88. You would be lucky to find keys at 5 ref right now. It looks like the market has moved on without backpack.tf as 5 - 5.44 seems commonplace now.

well 5 is still easy to find

I bought a lot last nigh

http://puu.sh/2NBSM.png

http://puu.sh/2NBT2.png

http://puu.sh/2NBTf.png

http://puu.sh/2NBTq.png

http://puu.sh/2NBUC.png

OMG DAE THINK KEYS SHOULD GO DOWN AND ANYONE WHO BUYS KEYS AT 5 REF IS EVIL YOLO!?!!!!1!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!???????????????

every counter comment he dislike wtf

Most comments get downvoted because they are irrelevant and not helpful.

Like this one.

I will be soooo sooo happy if Valve removes this Store shit, every key (and all stuff around it) will be removed and the game returns to state when it was released. .

So let me get this straight... the admins will ban the members of an entire group for implying that they'll attempt to manipulate the price of keys lower but keep coming up with excuses to let a trade restricted rep-whore vote spammer who got caught dealing in carded keys that has clearly stated his intentions are to screw up the market stay.

[url]http://tinypic.com/view.php?pic=3515mzc&s=5[/url]

No hypocrisy there at all. /sarcasm

Stay classy guys.

scrap.tf now buy at 5 and sell at 5.22.. time for a new suggestion!

man i thought you were banned from suggesting key prices

Weren't you banned from making key suggestions.

is just scrap.tf not me

relax

long.... how long are you going to keep this up?

Upvote, any keys I've tried to sell recently for 5.11 have sold in minutes.

hey long how do you get your proof if you're banned on outpost. I think all your alts are banned there too

Give this guy (Long) a break guys. I know he is a douche-bag, an accomplice to carders and all good things you want to add but as far as his suggestion is concerned its almost correct. Most of us willingly or unwillingly end up buying keys for at-least 5 ref each.

If we forget for a minute the price of keys on backpack.tf yet, we pay between 5.11-5.22 ref for keys. Why the fuck we do that? The price is 4.66 ref. Y aren't we adamant to buy them at 4.66 ref. Why are their shitloads of people buying them at 5 ref?

80% of the traders and unscathed by the key price change on outpost, because they get buyers who pay their price and can only cry on backpack.tf about prices and never really follow them in real life. They would happily buy a key for 4.66 ref but when time comes to sell them those assholes would want 5.11 ref. If they are not using their main account then they have got heaps of alt account. They are fucking hipocrates.

People need to ask themselves why they need keys in the first place. To open a crate and get something worth 1.33 or less?

We need keys because people want keys.

CIRCULAR REASONING FOR THE WIN

Well you can call it a gamble actually; or a hope to be that lucky guy to unbox a burning team captain. Or in some cases definite profit, opening a dropped crate 40, if lucky, in the past and opening a dropped crate, if lucky again, 50 now.

http://imgur.com/a/t71sl

Proof everything Long is doing is out of spite/greed.

the weird thing is metal value isn't decreasing. Only the value of keys are increasing. 1.33 ref will still get you a craft hat. Also valve needs to make metal more useful like there is nothing i really want to make with it. Another thing is that by the time this gets accepted keys will have risen again :c.

the only reason craft hats still at 1.33 is because of the store recipe.

He's right. Craft hats will always be around 1.33 or 1.44 since you can either spend 3 ref to make a hat or spend 2 craft hats to make a hat.

I think you only want the key to rise up look at your key 642

the richest player are soo greedy

but the middle rich player want to sell the key for 2.33 or 3ref

soo in the 2014 or 2015 good bye keys no one ever wanted to buy a key or if someone voted to down and aproove yehey to economy

"I think you only want the key to rise up look at your key 642 "

Long is still trade banned..

"the richest player are soo greedy"

And only the greedy guys try to make accurate prices. /s

"but the middle rich player want to sell the key for 2.33 or 3ref"

That's why we have people who are willing to pay 5.11 Ref each.

"soo in the 2014 or 2015 good bye keys no one ever wanted to buy a key or if someone voted to down and aproove yehey to economy"

You are a whiner, you don't even know how a fucking economy works. No demand = Price needs to go down. We have a high demand for Keys now and traders are still willing to pay higher prices every day.

How does one simply use Tf2finance.com as evidence?

did you just ignore a wall of proof ?

Letting someone make suggestions who has stated that he wants to intentionally price-fix to ruin TF2's economy reflects badly on backpack.tf

By your logic, shouldn't quickbuys not count too?

"...Given how volatile key prices are, a reclaimed range is acceptable, but it shouldn't get any bigger than that. Suggestions aiming just to shorten the range should be closed..."

Quoting a private message made by Vincent that I agree with. I will not be letting trades for basically shortening the range through, they are just unnecessary headaches. Only suggest a new range if it is a whole scrap higher and no larger than .33 range. (NOTE: VINCENT ACCEPTING THE LAST SUGGESTION WAS JUST FIXING THE RECLAIMED MAX RANGE)

Also, I would like to mention this: Me accepting the lower range was a one-tie thing, if you want the low range (4.66-4.77) to stay, you will have to provide continuous proof of 4.66-4.77 sales (not just link to the old proof) and a whole lot more of it (atleast double unless not sold already)