Suggestion: Mann Co. Supply Crate Key at 7.11–7.22 ref

I have one invalid link hidden somewhere in the suggestion. First person to add me and message me which one it is (Which number in which section) in the hour I can edit this gets to make me say one thing anywhere in the suggestion that isn't damaging to me or others.

I know a lot of people bitch about cleverpun handing out all these warnings, but it's true. In my old suggestions, I used to always put this at the end:

[url]http://puu.sh/6bYMk.png[/url]

The bad proof, downvote thing is just as bad as the opposite. Please don't comment if you aren't supporting, providing counterproof or have something REALLY important to say.

Thanks for reading

More proof of buyers at 7.11 here :) aka My name :D

I think most people would agree that key prices are too high, but for legit reasons. On the other hand, this is some solid ass proof, upvote from me :)

I heard the most legit explanation for rising key prices a while ago, more low end players, more weapon drops, more metal, metal devalued, keys worth more metal

I've been saying this to people all time. I think instead of crafting metal, players could get metal from an online bank instead, so that way metal isn't constantly being deflated.

Sadly, where do you think that metal comes from? Crafting :/

You could craft the metal into hats? That's what I do at this point… Unless I really need an extra key for some reason.

But you mostly make a loss this way (unless you really like the specific hat) and a lot of people would need to follow this idea otherwise it will do nothing

I know, I really have no use for ref though unless I want to buy some cheap hats that I plan on keeping, it isn't really meant for profit. Just for fun :P

Solid ass proof? Did you even check the links properly?

His unsuccessful buyers at 7 ref successfully bought many.

Please check the links in the future before saying "upvote" and blind voting. Thank you.

At the time of commenting, many of them were still unsuccessful. Since then, some have been successful in their purchases as of now.

Keep in mind the date at when the proof was taken, changes do occur.

Nice Job xD

http://www.tf2outpost.com/trade/10227401

Just wait one more month so you can laugh at them...

im selling keys for 10.77 and it didnt get closed for troll-trade yet-this makes me think...

http://www.tf2outpost.com/trade/16655125

You think that's funny?

The trade offer got closed. :O

I saw one selling for 10 and buying for 6 lol

man, people didnt get outpost sarcasm back then

reopen it in a few months >:3

Closed forever, thank you based jon

I don't know. The proof is good and all. But I only managed to sell 1 key for 7.22 in 2 days. 7 ref is definitely a quicksell and 7.11 is also an easy sale. Yeah I guess this is a fair range.

Upvote.

Scrap.tf is buying keys for 7.11 and selling for 7.22. You would have to be STUPID to sell them for 7 keys!

Sounds good, selling keys for 7 keys

YEP keys for 7 keys= very gud deal

No duh xD and yeh people are just troll downvoting

Not sure if everyone's downvoting it because of the mistake, or because of the comment itself.

While this is good proof, and I also sell keys for 7.11 constantly (and get tons of adds from tf2outpost) you can still buy many keys for 7 ref or even 6.88. While some people consider that a quicksale, there are tons of sellers for 6.88. Also, while there have been keys sold for 7.22, it seems a little too high. I think a better price suggestion would be 7-7.11, until there are more buyers/sellers for 7.22

That would mean a one week cooldown, and by then, it would no longer be valid

So much For that 1 week Cooldown time Rule..

Cooldowns are lower if the increase is bigger. You can find the complete rules here; http://forums.backpack.tf/index.php?/topic/2620-key-cooldown-guidelines-read-before-making-key-suggestions/

Make a new rule? Its killer

Only if you call a rule that's over 6 months old "new."

I think he's asking for a new rule, this current one encourages larger bumps which may not be accurate to what the current value is on the market

why there is -9 score? Well atleast i did like it.

I believe that there is no reason why 7 ref shouldn't be in the range

Just gonna post this here to people who want to know how these keys are raising. An analogy, written by Yours Truly:

"People being able to sell at more and more isn't our fault. It's like there are a bunch of cabbages (keys), and there are is an influx of seeds (ref). Let's say you need to plant cabbages together so they have company, and when they're planted like this, it produces one. So, you need, at the beginning, 3 seeds planted together to produce a single cabbage. This would mean that seeds would be worth less and less since there's a lot of them. Because of the influx of the seeds, people keep planting more than 3 in the ground, because the more you plant together, the faster they grow, and the faster they sell. Eventually, farmers are planting 12+ seeds to get a single cabbage, and the price continues to raise, because seeds, while cheap, are not free. And, eventually, they'll become so much, the cabbage industry will implode and create coleslaw."

Hope that explains everything. Thanks

So in other word, the Key price is rising faster than the amount of Refined being created.

I don't think this is really proof. This is ignoring that most likely allot the sellers that are selling at 7.11 ref got them at 7 ref like me. just because some people are selling at a higher price than suggested dose not mean that that should be the price because a majority of key interactions are at 7 ref right now.

agreed. Nothing more to be said

http://www.tf2outpost.com/trade/17025228 sold without a bump for 7

Very solid proof. As much as I don't like how quickly keys are rising I can't argue with that proof.

Welp, all the proof is there...upvote from me... <3

i think 7-7.11 will be better since the all got accepted with buyers for the suggested prices and i see you don't have buyers for 7.22

many real traders (not bot) still selling for 6.88-7, I think the price is good for a while longer. Steam forums and community forums still have below bp - bp prices without over charging. No Vote

It's this thing called Key Banking... if your going to sell a key you would always sell it for more than the original price and buy for lower. And since it's "A good Idea" everyone does it! So you can only get your keys for higher than the actual amount. And so when Backpack.tf raises the price, the Keybankers do also. I think the next key suggestion that raises the key price should exclude all key bankers...

Just a small note as I haven't looked at the rest yet, from your proof:

10. http://www.tf2outpost.com/trade/17052363 Sold 97

He says he sold 97. There is no proof for it. That trade was opened yesterday, and right now he has 0 keys and only 55 refined in his backpack - unless he is using an alt account or something (unlikely) it is virtually impossible he sold that many.

he hasn't... its just marketing techniques so people feel that its a good price since '97' people have sold it

most of the proof is for seven ref which isn't in the new range down vote for me.

Your unsuccessful buyers

They actually bought some. People nowdays tend to not comment on the trade and simply go straight to trading business.

http://bazaar.tf/trade/624427 ---> Bought 4 keys

http://www.tf2outpost.com/trade/17021851 --> Seems like bought few.

http://www.tf2outpost.com/trade/17021682 --> How do you expect this buyer to buy if he has not even bothered to bump his trade at all.

http://www.tf2outpost.com/trade/17021253 --> Closed; Successfully bought keys and then used those keys to buy other items. No keys/metals in backpack.

http://www.tf2outpost.com/trade/17021067 --> Never bumped

http://www.tf2outpost.com/trade/17021126 --> Bought 3. Check bp history

http://www.tf2outpost.com/trade/17020689 --> Bought and closed

http://bazaar.tf/trade/624322 --> You can clearly see that he crossed out 5 from 3 to 1 and then closed his suggestion. So, this one clearly proves at least either 5+ person sold that item to him or 1 person himself/herself sold 5+ keys to him.

http://www.tf2outpost.com/trade/17020499 --> Without even bumping, he successfully bought 5 keys.

http://tf2tp.com/trade.php?trade=9973783 --> Bought and closed

http://www.tf2outpost.com/trade/17019747 --> History clearly shows he bought keys and he clearly now mentioned "OUT OF STOCK"

http://www.tf2outpost.com/trade/17019361 --> Has been buying keys for a while now for 7 ref. Mass buyer and is buying successfully

http://bazaar.tf/trade/624169 --> Bought and closed

http://www.tf2outpost.com/trade/17018053 --> Bought and closed

Not going above 15 links in your "Unsuccessful buyers at 7 ref:" This clearly shows that it is possible to buy at 7 ref. You have now just provided counter-proof against yourself.

:3 That's better. I like you countered his post. A C-c-c-combo breaker.

DOWNVOTE

That list of proof @@

#adore

What most people fail to realize is that backpack.tf admins are just trying to put what ever the going price is, if the admins were to the price at one scrap you would still have to pay 7.11 because that's what people are paying for keys or if keys were put at 100 refined people would still be able to buy then for 7.11 because that's what they are going for right now.

So if you want keys to go down for what ever reason don't pay that much, if you want them to go up pay 7.66, because this suggestion is based off what people payed for them.

I really don't care if they go up or down. besides I mostly unbox event crates.

hey im the first comment for 110 7 ref sold pile

Pretty solid proof, but you know, I found like 10 or so links that are a bit not quite valid out of the hundred-something.

Same dude:

http://www.tf2outpost.com/trade/17013160

http://www.tf2outpost.com/trade/17016670

http://www.tf2outpost.com/trade/17013855 Didn't sell, closed trade.

http://www.tf2outpost.com/trade/17020180 Didn't sell, closed trade.

http://www.tf2outpost.com/trade/17052363 Highly doubt the man sold 97+ keys in the span of 3 days, outperforming a machine/bot.

http://tf2tp.com/trade.php?trade=9973598 Bought key(s)

http://www.tf2outpost.com/trade/17017389 Bought key(s)

http://www.tf2outpost.com/trade/17017982 Bought key(s)

http://bazaar.tf/trade/624322 Bought key(s)

http://www.tf2outpost.com/trade/17021889 Bought key(s) (possibly for 7.11 not just 7)

http://www.tf2outpost.com/trade/17020689 Bought key(s)

There is probably some more, I only checked the first hundred of them, until I got lazy. Might wanna rearrange it or remove it from your proof.

Also might wanna look through your proof, might find an error or two.

Ctrl + F to find these links.

All buyers are successful, but no one posted in his trades, so 7 Ref still possible, downvote

there needs to be at least a 2 week cooldown

I haven't had any problems buying keys at 7 ref

All the people that are hating that keys rise are mad, but honestly more refined comes into circulation because of the number of weekly drops and because of that the market of refined metal is slowly becoming inflated just like the United States.

Btw guys, the proof is actually good. Many (not all) of the people downvoting are not actually looking at proof, just the arrow. As his suggestion states, please do not vote if you are just reading arrows and nothing else. I understand that there are a few things that are not entirely correct, but the last time the suggestion was edited was 3 days ago. "Unsuccessful buyers are successful" were not successful until a couple days ago.

Sir, Suggestion is good? Did you read the massive amounts of counter-proof given to this suggestion? I myself gave a hell lot of ton of counter-proof in this suggestion.

Many has bought keys at 7 ref the day OP made this suggestion. Its even better if the buyer bought keys after 2 days OP posted this suggestion. So, you are also basically counter-proofing this suggestion as well, claiming that buyers bought keys at 7 ref after 2 days of posting this suggestion.

It only shows that it is possible to buy key at 7 ref.

I will post some additional counter-proof.

Successful Buyers at 7 ref

http://www.tf2outpost.com/trade/17102269 --> 2 adds; 1 about 6 hours ago, another about just about 1 hour ago.

http://www.tf2outpost.com/trade/17018280 ---> Bought 4 keys within the last 4 days.

http://www.tf2outpost.com/trade/17055099 --> Mass buyer, bought many and still buying.

http://www.tf2outpost.com/trade/17050791 ---> Bought 2 keys, check bp history.

http://www.tf2outpost.com/trade/16750971 ---> Bought 3 keys, last comment "added" was 1 day ago.

http://www.tf2outpost.com/trade/17067498 ---> Holly molly, bought many keys at 7 ref. 4 people commented "added" during the last two days.

http://www.tf2outpost.com/trade/17104611 ---> Bought 2 keys, currently out of metal; Most likely restocking.

http://www.tf2outpost.com/trade/17037331 --> Bought many keys during the course of last 3 days, recently got 1 outside his bp. "New items"

Won't bother to go over the first 2 pages. Went to first 2 pages of Outpost buyers and already found this many. Almost about 10 links.

I was staying neutral the whole time, even though I provided counter-proof about 1 and a half day ago. Want to know why? I wanted to see if buyers are still successful at buying keys at 7 ref after 3 days of posting this suggestion.

Seems like 7 ref is still possible.

Pulling the gear down

=====

Just going to post my 2 cents here on this post. This is what I think is happening...

You see 2 grocery stores, one is about a mile away(Lets call it Darki) and another one is closest to your house(Lets call it Hampton) but the closer one is a bit more expensive than the store that is mile away. So, you are that kind of buyer who is impatient and does not want to walk over to the Darki store and save money. So, you instead head over to the expensive one and pay over 1 cents to 5 cents over the market price.

Now, here is me. I am a patient buyer even though I have to be at work within an hour, so I think to myself, why pay over the market price when I can try to get one in the market price just a mile away? So I start walking to the Darki store and buy myself a sweet snack just at the market price which is $7 and save myself some money and later use it for good purposes.

The counter-proof I provided are me. The successful sellers/buyers above market price you posted are buyers who don't want to waste time and get it over with by paying over 1 to 5 cents over the market price. This happens in real world too. You will find both type of buyers. So, who do community much prefers? Impatient buyers or patient buyers? I think its the second one :P

http://www.tf2outpost.com/trade/17021253

http://www.tf2outpost.com/trade/17020499

http://www.tf2outpost.com/trade/17019361

http://www.tf2outpost.com/trade/17018053

http://www.tf2outpost.com/trade/17017982

http://www.tf2outpost.com/trade/17017671

http://www.tf2outpost.com/trade/17017645

http://www.tf2outpost.com/trade/17017389

Almost half of the "unsuccessful" buyers buying at 7 ref were successful.

Not half, all of'em. I even added recent successful buyers at 7 ref above your comment.

I'm not going to write a long text complaining about keys, and how they go up. However, everyone one wants to make profit. And to say you don't is a complete lie. And as much as it is the sellers fault for selling at 8 ref it's also the buyers fault, who ENCOURAGES them to keep selling by buying their key. Thats why backpack is NOT a mafia, or a conspiracy. It simply represents what people are willing to pay. Your not willing to pay 7.22? Too bad, because other people are. And for all those people who believe that keys will be worth more than buds, no. Buds are based on keys. Keys become 100 ref, buds will still be 20 keys(or whatever it happens to be ATM). So Upvote.

Also, for those people who keep complaining about keys going up, who do you think you would sell a crate 57 too. A guy offering a scrap, or a guy offering a Burning Team Captain. inb4"The guy offering a scrap"

Its not greed. its human nature, now leave me alone so I can cry about keys being 8 ref D:

And "your ehhh, downvote, keys to high" isn't changing a thing. The admins decide pass, or no pass. All you do is vote on wether you think this is gonna pass. Which it is.

Also 53 in the 7.11 solds is also the junk one :D

You don't have to say anything though, we both know what you are thinking.

Aw, ya ruined it for everyone

Well if you really want you can call me the bestest proof reviewer ever.

Good solid proof, upvoted.

Okay.

We get it. Its time for another key suggestion, this was bound to happen at some point as more weapons and items drop, more metal is made and the price of metal is inflated. What I really don't understand is that it was already understood that the key price would rise, but why put forth the effort to try and escalate a new key price right after the last key price raise got accepted. There was a tremendous amount of tension going on with the last key suggestion which lasted many days. So why to make another rise in key prices? Certainly not to be proportional with the amount of metal in the world as there has not been a single soul who dared try to make a suggestion with keys equivalented to metal in the world.

Now don't get me wrong, I'm not trying to be a center of attention bringing this up nor do I wish to bash the key price suggestion, but couldn't this key suggestion be held off to give the community a break? It was like I stated earlier, key prices will raise as more metal is entering tf2 yet no one ever tries to make key prices proportional to the metal in tf2. It's fine, but the price raising can be stalled to an extent especially when one too many on bp.tf can expect key price rises. This is just a statement that I came up with as I'm looking at how I beneficial raising the price would be...for now. Doesn't mean a price change is not in check it just means if there is willpower to restrain some unwanted change from affecting a society ( in this case the tf2 one) then is should be controlled. But that's just coming from me, this is a group collaboration, let's see what bp.tf can do.

The site is supposed to reflect the general market prices of these items. Regardless of whether or not we like it, the price has gone up. Scrap.tf is paying 7.11 each (if you want to blame a single entity, blame them). If I were a new trader and read the price of keys were 7 ref and sold for that price, then found out they were 7.22, I would not be very happy that I was given bad information. Reflecting the current market sounds a more reasonable than "stalling to an extent" listing the accurate price.

Scrap.tf is either going in one of two ways.

One, after a new price is suggested they raise the price in order to keep a consistent income ( I see fair as they wait for bp.tf

Two, they go ahead and raise the price and because they can influence people, people go with what scrap.tf says. (Not fair in the slightest).

Just picture it like this, if everyone supposedly dropped the key pricing down to say 5 ref and followed the first statement, scrap.tf would lose a lot of profit with more people buying out instead of selling before scrap.tf could price change. ( group over a site)

Scrap.tf lowers their buy pricing to 5 ref to sell but 5.33 to buy, people could easily take advantage if that pricing with the situation we are in now and buy out.

Both situations sound repetitive: yes, they do. However in the first example there is a given group power taking control of the situation and lowering the pricing themselves rather than wait for an unrepresented authority to change what they do and can't do.

That would not work because the smart people would buy up all of the 5 ref keys and sell them for what the market is actually buying them at: 7.11-7.22

If it's a group of people selling at 5, then they're going to be sold out near instantly.

No, it's not possible to have "everyone" sell at 5.

But what if some of the richest and most famous TF2 traders decide to get a ton of refined and buy keys for 0.22 Refined less than the normal price and sell for that price too? Ofc it would need organisation etc., but if there would be alot of people doing the same the community could slowly lower the price of keys.

This would actually work if there would not be that terrible profit greed I see every day...

There will always be people out to make profit no matter what. As long as people are willing to pay that extra scrap or two, key prices are most likely to continue to rise.

i think, its aproproiate to quote AcesGamer here after BradPitt, owner of this site said something about equal to what you said

BradPitt wrote: "First of all, http://backpack.tf is a pricing guide; It's not a bible. We don't force you to use these prices when you trade, but we provide you with a guideline of what people agreed on the item's value. You can sell for more or less if you want, it's really up to you."

AcesGamer replied: "Except this is wrong. The way the website is set up, the way prices are dictated, and the way the community (and especially admins) participate in suggestions makes it very much like a bible, and not merely a reference. A good example is key prices: Whenever a new price is set, every single outpost trade jumps up to follow the "guideline". Anything set lower immediately gets flamed or shut down. You may think high and mighty of your website, but that's not how the community sees it.

In addition to this, you cannot advertise the website as "community driven prices", when it's quite the opposite; Absolutely incompetent admins dictate whether their opinion (which is much better and informed than the rest of the community, obviously) overrides proof given by actual traders. Coming to mind are key suggestions accepted where 20 or so handpicked trades where people are selling for 0.11 more, is considered enough proof to raise the price ceiling, when those trades are in reality an exception. (Mind you these suggestions also had somewhere near -800 votes) Now I know your answer to this will be: "Admins accept suggestions on proof provided, not on community votes", and that's fine, except 20, or even 30 or 40 trades out of mere thousands is NOT the majority of what the entire community is currently selling/buying for.

The exact same goes for unusuals: "proof provided" is mostly c/o's that may have been on impulse, or shady offers. In fact, to test this myself, a while ago I made a suggestion on the price of my Eerie Swagman's Swatter to raise it to around 5 buds, showing my outpost trade as proof. The only time I had been offered 5 buds was in cash by a shady individual that I rejected. Guess what? The suggestion was accepted.

I'd even go as far as to say that backpack.tf is the worst website in the TF2 community (trust me, that's a pretty hard award to get). The original intention behind it being a more fair and community driven "spreadsheet", but it just turned out to be quite the opposite -- Incompetent admins deemed as the most trustworthy pricecheckers, corruption by key traders (Just go and review old key suggestions to see for yourself), ridiculous advertisement and plugins being put everywhere, further enforcing this "Bible" concept, etc.

Thanks for everything you've created, I'm sure we're all much better off now than we were before."

This is the most accurate statement to this website i have found. Luckily, i left trading.

Oh and btw: yeea, i know this will be hidden and ill get warned...cleverpun. http://forums.steamrep.com/threads/backpack-tf-ongoing-key-price-manipulation.31630/

Take it to the forums, suggestions aren't your blog

just proving me right.

Just making yourself look worse.

Not-very-cleverpun instead of responding to every little piece of critisism with ''Duh, take it to de forumz pl0x'' how about actually stickinh up for yourself? People obviously agree with Freshwater and Disagreeyou with you (Look at the like ratio) The more you ignore these claims, the more people see through you man.

I don't respond to ignorant criticism on suggestions because this is not the place for it--hence my "take it to the forums" attitude.

I made a cursory post defending myself and explaining certain common misconceptions here; http://forums.backpack.tf/index.php?/topic/6001-addressing-criticism-of-backpacktf/ You are welcome to post there, where it is appropriate and relevant.

And the amount of likes something has doesn't have anything to do with its accuracy; http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Argumentum_ad_populum

So many negative votes.

Well, looks like 7 ref is a very quick sell. 7.11 seems to be the norm, but 7.22 looks possible. Gonna say yes.

Also solid proof upvote

god soon this will be 10. I do agree, 7 ref is nearly a quicksell now.. crazy

If keys continue to rise at the current rate (~0.25 Ref per month) we'll have 10 Ref Keys in a year... Happy new year I guess.

haha...and it's crazy how people are willing to pay this much, I quit for 6 months (when i quit they were about 2.44) and I came back and they were like 5 XD

Once key prices exceed 8 ref+a weapon, the mannconomy is screwed. $2.50/0.30-0.32 ~0.31=8.06 ref (2 d.p.). It would be cheaper to buy keys from the mann co store than buy from anywhere else. And if Valve wanted to, they could kick us in the guts harder by increasing the price of keys to $5 each...

well the reason they went up is because of idlers...The metal lost it's value since they were idling for hats and weps

*its

pardon my grammar

But that's comparing the value of metal by others (Not by valve) to the value of keys by valve. So lets say weapons were 1c each. Scrap at 2c, Ref at 9c. Keys won't go over 27.77 ref. Yay.

Also, I've been taking keys as 7.33 when getting change for items.

Upvote.

That was fast. Upvote.

What about the 1 week cool down?

3 days for keys afaik

Um... it died?

Cooldowns are lower if the increase is bigger. You can find the complete rules here; http://forums.backpack.tf/index.php?/topic/2620-key-cooldown-guidelines-read-before-making-key-suggestions/

Thanks for raising keys even higher. Now I can get even more hats from just $2.50

Upboat :D

this is absolutely true haha, who the hell buys keys with metal anyway

$2.30-$2.40 - Use steam market :P

1.8-1.9 on sourceop

Sourceop is something that many dislike to use or do not know.

and?

its still a place where you can trade, earn good rep, and not pay $2.30+.

I am one of the best price sellers of keys at sourceop ( sold about 350-400 keys in last month). So do not preach to me. The reason I referred to steam market was because unlike source op, everyone knows about it and is more trusted and commonly used.

huh, kinda putting yourself on that high-horse arent ya-i mean, sorry your highness.

and why the hell are you putting it down? buying/selling keys on the steam market isnt the same as buying/selling them on sourceop. its just another option, just as the steam market is convenience in the same way autpost is, but it doesnt necessarily make it a more accurate way to price keys.

Keep it civil, verbal warning

High-horse? I think it was necessary to put you on track.

What are you talking about? How the hell is I am pricing keys and on what? My statement only meant that steam market is more widely and often used then sourceop. That's it.

Do not post useless comments. Keep them to yourself.

Keep it civil, verbal warning

Steam market is only 1 cent below store price now (in €).

may be currency conversion issues, its still $2.39 in $$$ for me.

has been for a long time, excluding sale times

just keep checking, it goes down to about $2 then back up to about $2.4 just gotta keep an eye on it

I have to wait until the 11th

Please try to stay on topic regarding the suggestion. What is relevant here are; personal experiences on the key trades, additional proof, issues with the provided proof, counterproof against suggested range, and thoughts on what range is most appropriate based on these factors. Community opinion on these matters are extremely important and off-topic matters distract from them severely.

In order to try to keep discussion on-topic, spam and unnecessary off-topic discussion (including discussion of the broader economy) will be be hidden. Abuse and rudeness will not be tolerated. For discussions on the economy and other tangential topics, we recommend the forums; http://forums.backpack.tf/

For discussion on keys in regards to the impact on the economy, this topic in particular is recommended; http://forums.backpack.tf/index.php?/topic/2580-the-one-and-only-key-price-topic-no-flame-wars-please-discussion-only/

For concerns as to how the site is treating comments in key suggestions, feel free to start a topic in the following forum; http://forums.backpack.tf/index.php?/forum/20-general-website-discussions/

These rules and guidelines apply to all key suggestions, past and present. In order to reduce potential confusion, the mod team is posting this summary in order to help bring attention to—and remind users of—these policies.

7 points on a cleverpun comment?! What is this bullshit?

Seriously, I think all commenters should read this. It has useful info and prevents me from dealing with less little red numbers next to my name

Absolutely this.

-2 now. Well at least people know why they are warned now.

I don't buy keys for metal generally but people have been accepting change for keys at 7 ref when I sell items without any issue for the last week.

I did buy 3 keys for 6.88 each yesterday in a game server though.

You can still buy keys at 7.

prove it then?

Jack already proved it (Check unsuccessful buyers at 7 ref)

ill grab a scrennie if i can

http://www.tf2outpost.com/trade/17055737

PERSONAL EXPERIENCE.

I have bought 2 keys for 7 ref. Therefore I see no need to inflate the prices.

(Personal Experiences are helpful and beneficial for this thread)

http://www.tf2outpost.com/trade/17055737

"I am not going to be an idiot and pay 1 scrap over because there is no way in hell I am going to encourage price raising on keys."

This is your one proof against all the proof for the rising of the keys, not too mention that in your trade you said that you are selling less than the market price as not too encourage the rising of the key.

Never said I was selling any keys.

I've bought about 10 keys over the past 2 or 3 days, all at 7 ref or below. NOT difficult to find them for that cheap. I see no reason to raise the prices of keys.

Dang it just sold a key for 7 ref. Eh who cares upvote.

Yet, another blind vote. Please check the links before saying something like this. Thank you.

I agree, it's pretty hard to find sellers for 7 ref, and all buyers at 7 ref take many bumps or just pure luck. Good, solid proof, upvoat.

i have over 400 keys and i dont care how much metal a key can get but if this suggestion passes and which am sure it will the value of key in real life cash will be raised from 2.17$ to 2.22$ this is insanely stupid someone need to adjust the price we have plenty of sellers selling keys for 1.8-1.9$.

People will always sell less for cash.

this is getting stupid i want to make a $$ suggestion for keys cant let it be at 2.22$ while in reality it sells for less than 2$ each

That is because only the refined to dollar counts; If you want to cash out: Sell keys for metal and the metal for cash. You'll make tons of profit.

Your second link doesn't seem legitimate. Have you got any proof that it was actually sold or was the trade just closed?

7 was such a nice number to deal with. Now it's a stray scrap extra :/

Not that I disprove of the price raise, because scrap.tf already buys at 7.11, which says a lot.

Dat paypal ref to keys price xD. Ref really needs an update

The issue with comparing Keys to Cash, and Refined to Cash is somehow.. the "comparison" becomes jumbled. When talking about Community Market prices, people forget to take into the account the 15% Transaction fees on the for sellers, and then comparing that with paypal prices of keys causes this vacuum of knowledge. Then comes into play the Refined price, where somehow.. people compare it's paypal value to keys community market value. Not taking into account Refined is sold a lot less thru cash transactions just because of it's lower value to backpack space proportion.

I don't "forget to take into account the fees". Currently the price of 1 ref on the community market is an effective 28-30 cents (from a key seller's POV) and 32-34 cents (from the buyer's POV). I do a lot of community market trading so I almost always have the price of single scrap evaluated in market cash (3.7-3.8 cents) depending on the normal key price of the day on the market.

Successful buyer at 7 ref.

8. http://www.tf2outpost.com/trade/17020689

9. http://bazaar.tf/trade/624322

10. http://www.tf2outpost.com/trade/17020499

11. http://tf2tp.com/trade.php?trade=9973783

12. http://www.tf2outpost.com/trade/17019747

13. http://www.tf2outpost.com/trade/17019361

14. http://bazaar.tf/trade/624169

15. http://www.tf2outpost.com/trade/17018053

16. http://www.tf2outpost.com/trade/17017982

17. http://www.tf2outpost.com/trade/17017671

18. http://www.tf2outpost.com/trade/17017645

19. http://www.tf2outpost.com/trade/17017389

20. http://tf2tp.com/trade.php?trade=9973598

Edit : they're from your "unsuccessful" buyers btw.

Let's add the rest of the "unsuccesful" 7 ref buyers:

1. http://bazaar.tf/trade/624427 - Check his bp, he got his 5 keys but has just not closed his trade.

2. http://www.tf2outpost.com/trade/17021889 - Last bumped 20 hrs ago, not valid in my opinion. You see, if you search for key buyers, the oldest trade that shows up is 17 minutes old. People like this literally won't even show up even when searching specifically for key buyers.

3. http://www.tf2outpost.com/trade/17021851 - Has bought 14 since opening his trade, see bp history of 2 days ago: http://backpack.tf/id/76561198028595578?time=1388908800

4. http://www.tf2outpost.com/trade/17021682 - Not bumped in 2 days, so not valid.

5. http://www.tf2outpost.com/trade/17021253 - Not bumped in 2 days, so not valid. Also closed.

6. http://www.tf2outpost.com/trade/17021126 Has bought at least 3, check bp history (http://backpack.tf/id/76561198044929356?time=1388908800) and note the "can buy multiple" in the description, but is just leaving his trade open.

7. http://www.tf2outpost.com/trade/17021067 - Not bumped in 2 days, so not valid.

It is all too easy to just spam links of open trades and have people believe that these trades are unsuccessful. Especially with key trades, people barely ever post on the trade itself - they just add the seller and do business.

tl;dr not a single valid link

The best comment ever.

Surely by pure logic which many seem to have an absence of. It should be over 50% yes i know you get the trolls but if more than half the community is not in favor what is even the point in bothering to ask us and create a website where we get to vote on the price of things anyway. May as well just be a spreadsheet like it was before.

I know its only one link but buying at 7 is possible: http://www.tf2outpost.com/trade/17055989

5th link = accepted without any kind of proof? I'm quite disappointed...

I also love it how the second suggestion was made by an impersonator.

None of the suggestions in those days had proof. And mattje never was a Mattie! impersonator

Maybe you're not aware of this, but this site works on proof and evidence, not popularity contests. It's unpopular for the price of keys to rise, but the admins are here to make sure that the site doesn't post prices of wishful thinking. No, votes really aren't that important. Usually, this is reflected in suggestions with 60-70% upvotes being rejected, but it also happens the other way.

The voting system isn't ignored, though. If you considered for a bit, you might understand its purpose. Personally, I thought that its purpose was common knowledge.

Votes, proof, and mods are all part of a system of checks and balances. Of course none of them have total control over the other, that is how checks and balances are supposed to work; in tandem.

On the vast majority of accepted suggestions the voters, proof, and mods all agree with each other, and it is those suggestions are easiest to defend after the fact. If a moderator is accepting/denying a suggestion against the voters wishes, they are required to post a comment explaining their decision. There is a way to publicly ask moderators to explain their decisions on the bp.tf forums. http://forums.backpack.tf/index.php?/topic/75-guidelines-for-suggestion-question-threads/

This is only one of several reasons why key suggestions take so much time to moderate; a third of the system can't be relied on, so there is more strain put on the other checks (mods and proof).

Take it to the forums, suggestions aren't your blog.

No, because they would sell instantly, meaning that it wouldn't warrant a drop.

Hmm...

I think Keys should be raising, because of the decrease of the amount of keys due to Steam Market. But NOT as fast as they do in the current rate. I believe a huge portion of the cause of these raises lies in the mindsets of key traders. "Oh, keys are 7 ref according to backpack.tf... That means I gotta sell mine for 7.22, right?" Yeah. They already increase their selling price despite the fact that they don't have to for the sake of the economy. Since people who want to buy keys HAVE TO agree with their price because no one's selling them for less, there is plenty of proof for a price increase, and thus a circle of key price increases follow.

Remember this is just a theory, and might not even be true, but I do not believe that keys rise by almost 5 ref in price in a couple of months because of another buying source.

Since price is rising again and i got alot of metal, i made my own trade for 7 ref each buy.

http://www.tf2outpost.com/trade/17015350 - 2 days old.

Now if you excuse me...im going to go through my trade history to tell how many i bought.

I seem to have bought 6 (in one trade i bought 3 from a person and in another trade i gabe peron a wep. don't think it makes much a difference really)

http://i.imgur.com/MAAKMiR.png

http://i.imgur.com/B2hiWJ4.png

http://i.imgur.com/12wBQH2.png - 3 keys

http://i.imgur.com/rmJoX1R.png - 2 keys, i gave 1 weapon (wrap assasin) as sweet (or just being a nice person)

This could be considered quickbuying or that people didn't know that price will be rising. I dunno. I just thought i would give my 2cents on the subject.

wasent there an 7 day cooldown thingy?

Cooldowns are lower if the increase is bigger. You can find the complete rules here; http://forums.backpack.tf/index.php?/topic/2620-key-cooldown-guidelines-read-before-making-key-suggestions/

Theoretically, should you reverse that? Since it encourages larger increases? How about 2 week cooldown with a max of 2 scrap increase UNLESS tf2outpost sellers are selling for at least 4 scrap over the price. Honestly, it's like parasites and birds. Both can feed off the other but only one of them can live without the other. Everyone already knows the nature of the two sites. Also pretty sure I'm the first comment trying to help out cleverpun.

So your problem is that it encourages larger increases, and you want to replace it with a version that encourages [i[even larger[/i] increases?

My suggestion was mainly so that outpost would have a period to cool down before a price change. Instead of reflecting outpost's reaction to backpack's reaction, it would help to observe the natural , slower flow of the price uninfluenced by other websites and base it off of that. It also includes if something drastic were to happen. Aka the at least 4 scrap over bit. Look at the prices of more common items, or even other currencies, like bill's hat. Key suggestions have quite a bit more commotion and cause more price influxes than other suggestions. Also, italics broke. Not really a problem, just a suggestion to the rules. It would also help cool down the "remember when keys where 2.33?" people, giving the admins more breathing room. I'm terrible at sentence structure so I took an extra 10 minutes proofreading this so my point would be clearer.

blame people buying for this range, not the suggester he's done nothing wrong, just helping out with more accurate prices

Wow! U have done great work with proof, a upvote for me!

I'm going to upvote this but I really think that backpack.tf should have a rule that you can suggest a price for the keys once a week.

Cooldowns are lower if the increase is bigger. You can find the complete rules here; http://forums.backpack.tf/index.php?/topic/2620-key-cooldown-guidelines-read-before-making-key-suggestions/

I'm sure if that ever happens, then it won't be the result of buyers and sellers. Valve would have to put keys on sale because a lot of people would love to buy keys for cheaper.

http://www.tf2outpost.com/trade/16967955

Sold eight for 7.11 Each

Took a Day

Sadly the Price must go up

I had hopes when the keys had a short stop at 6 ref. Good proof, sadly.

I honestly hate how keys are raising crazily in price but good proof.

Upboat

Meh most trades aren't even 1 week old. And missing for 1-2 days doesn't really mean that that the seller/buyer is inactive/unsuccessful. Many users don't even leave a comment to show that they are interested. Like many people do they add the seller directly. I am aware that the price should rise yes but those proofs are chaotic (Some of them are closed). And vote system is becoming more and more irrelevant. (my opinion)

I like how just making a trade saying "I sold ... keys" proves I've sold that many. It's nice. I heard we lived in a world where you could not tell a lie.

Before you making a poor suggestion like this,I had many adds for 7 refined and im sure that guys you put in the description saying they are unsuccesfull buyers,most ppl don't comment on the trade,they just add the buyer.

Obvious downvote

I want it to go up... Reason: Many people want to buy keys for 7.33 so I think put up to atleast 7.33 ref! :D

nope, price should stay as it is, maybe even go down, people need to stop paying to much for an unlimited supply and hight demanded, for no reason, item.

Disagreed. Paying at 7 ref PURE lowered to 6.33 ref? Pretty stupid. These KEYS are the things that make unusuals and pretty much EVERYTHING more expensive! I really need to buy an unusual now :l

Unfortunately, upvote. .-.

This proves that you have not clicked and checked the links. Lots of successful buyers for 7 ref from his unsuccessful buyers at 7 ref.

"If you are butthurt about keys rising but proof is sold, upvote"

If he tells you to do something unthinkable, you would do that?

You are suppose to vote based on proof. Not what someone tells you to. Also, I am pretty sure this is against the rules. He is clearly implying to vote blindly.

That was suppose to be a joke. And yea, I can admit that I didn't look at the proof, but I only upvoted because on outpost there's tons of trades that can successfully sell keys for 7.11 in a matter of minutes, and trades that sell for 7 in a matter of seconds. Anyway, hope you're done trying to teach me how to vote, please stop instigating, thank you.

Should have a range higher than 7, sure.

But plenty of trades still at 7.

Plenty? They rarely show up and once they do, they get taken within seconds.

If your comments were calm and objective, they wouldn't need to be removed.

i like how you're always watching over key suggestions :>

they were calm and objective

so why

>calm and objective

>Its getting stupid of how muck keys are increasing

>they should be 3.66-4.33

How is that calm and/or objective?

how is saying stupid not calm?

i didnt have it in all caps nor did i seem to be yelling it

should be is saying a suggestion in a different way

After the reset this is just plain truth. It takes days to buy keys under 7.11 at this point.

Bought 5 keys for 7 ref each in the last 2 days. You just need to know where to look.

The BIGGEST question, is if this will go through. I got 70% sure it will. Th other 30 is hope, if it doesn't go through, the demand for keys will stop and maybe. JUST MAYBE, someone will lower it.

I hate seeing the price of keys continue to rise, but I can not argue with the proof that has been posted plus the multiple hours on trade servers for the last 2 days. upvote for you mate.

Few days ago in posted a buying trade for 7 ref and I got 3 adds in ~10 mins. I don't believe key prices are rising that fast. And this + the Bleu's comment shows that 7 is still doable.

Obvious price manipulation.

And one more thing. With all those sales and succesful buyers at 7 ref you only showed that 7 ref is the most common price. Yes, they may go quick, but it's still the most common traded price and yet you still try to remove it from the range.

Like I sayed obvious price manipulation.

Ageed. All of his unsuccessful buyers at 7 ref successful bought keys. Over that, one of the links he provided at unsuccessful buyers, happen to be a mass buyer and still buying some at that price.

i really hate to say but the key prices arnt really changing if you look at the treand. if you look at it, back when they were 2.33, metal was worth like a dollar, so they were worth about 2.3 dollars. now with keys at 7 ish ref, metal is between $0.30-0.33, so voting on key prices really doesnt change their value. voting on the price of metal does. ive got to hand it to this guy, he found a lot of solid proof, but in general, voting on key prices is irrelevent to changing their value because metal keeps dropping in value. metal now is at what a rec used to be, so the price is actually the exact same. it was just easier to get keys when metal was $1.00 ish and keys were 2.33. made everything simple

I agree but you are looking at this wrong. metal and keys are both sold for paypal cash. People that sell in the paypal cash market will evaluate at any given time whether the conversion to ref for sale would make sense to them.

Seller for 7 ref

http://www.tf2outpost.com/trade/17092849

http://www.tf2outpost.com/trade/17091737

If you look at trade.tf there's a lot selling for 7 ref.

Successful buyer at 7 ref.

http://www.tf2outpost.com/trade/17072168 - bought one.

http://www.tf2outpost.com/trade/17061909 - got an add.

http://www.tf2outpost.com/trade/17019361- has a lot of new keys.

http://www.tf2outpost.com/trade/10986248 - bought tons ?

http://www.tf2outpost.com/trade/16864444

http://www.tf2outpost.com/trade/17050180

Solid counter proof there. Especially the one with 1,247 views. This proofs that most users don't comment to a trade to show that they are interested. They add the user directly.

Seller for 7 ref

http://www.tf2outpost.com/trade/17092849 - instasold within less than a minute, according to comments

http://www.tf2outpost.com/trade/17091737 - never bumped

If you look at trade.tf there's a lot selling for 7 ref.

Successful buyer at 7 ref.

http://www.tf2outpost.com/trade/17072168 - legit

http://www.tf2outpost.com/trade/17061909 - private profile, sold?

http://www.tf2outpost.com/trade/17019361- most keys didn't even come from buying keys for metal, if you check histories, most of them came from gooby and Commander Green, both seem to have bought some of the steam games listed on the seller's profile

http://www.tf2outpost.com/trade/10986248 - post open since MAY, last obvious sale was in october, later sales are uknown

http://www.tf2outpost.com/trade/16864444 - legit

http://www.tf2outpost.com/trade/17050180 - legit?

The fact that most of your buyer links have only 1-2 sales over the span of a week show that they actually aren't so successful.

Range doesn't include 7 ref which is still possible to buy keys at. Downvote

I still don't get one thing: if 1 refined is supposed to cost 0,30 €, and the key cost (in refined) 7, that makes the complessive prices around 2,10 €, and if i remember right the price on the Market are even lower that; so, what's the sense of this?

Anyway, i must upvote; your suggestion are right, and it's not your fault if the market is going this way, so i can't be angry with you.

Its not right sir/ma'am. He has faults in his suggestion, especially in the unsuccessful buyers at 7 ref. All of the links he provided bought keys at that price.

Know what? You're right, i made quite a bit mistake in that. Thanks for the help <3

upvote solid proofs

I'm really starting to get tired of this.

Let me make one thing clear. I may not take bussness or invest in stocks but I can tell you that ANY price you put on any item will automatically have a plus-or-minus range. So, I a key sells for, say 7 ref, there will be a +- of .25 percent; therefore, a key will have a range of NOT ONLY +1.66 (8.66), but a range of MINUS 1.66 (5.33). anything above or below this range is considered lowballing or highballing. Don't get me wrong, your proof of +.25% is fine and dandy, but YOU CAN STILL SELL A KEY BELOW 7 REF. It make take more time to buy a key at 6-6.66 ref, per say, but you still can do it. It frustrates me that I update my price as soon as the price of keys is changed only to sell 5-6 keys at a reasonable profit before it is changed again, loosing my profit. You proof of buyers over 7 ref is great, don't get me wrong, but I find this change very unreasonable and inopportune. One other thing. Again, I don't claim to be a bussness guru, but lets say the price of refined stays at .30-.33 cents, that means it takes 7.66-8.33 ref to trade a key if you buy refined metal (assuming keys are $2.50). If the price of keys goes past this range, we are doing something terribly, terribly wrong. "Now I can buy a key for $2.50 or %2.30-.40 on the steam market and make instant profit!" That's what will happen. Please tell me someone sees this! JacustJack, I don't know if you count this as something important to say, apologies if it isn't, but I feel it must be said.

0.25% is not the same 0.25 the price of a key, that'd be 25%

Also, as far as I know, both sales at 5.33 or 8.66 are not occurring, or at least extremely rare, and should not be included in-range. The problem is not people not being able to sell keys below 7 refined, in fact plenty of buying would love that. The problem is that not enough are doing it at or below 7 refined to sustain the demand, so people continually buy for higher.

I can't discern any more information from that statement, though. Other than you're relying on backpack.tf to be your basis for key prices and believe you're losing profit if key prices rise even though you're still left with more and more refined from your flipping. You're argument just really seems like a poor attempt to add a lot of economic terms, and I'm not really sure if its supporting or against since its just a crazy jumble of words.

You know, I hate relying on backpack.tf to be my basis for prices, but since everyone uses backpack.tf as if it's the ten commandments of trading, I am forced to base my prices on this. No, I don't buy for .25% lower/higher, and I do not suggest we should have a huge range, that's just the acceptable distance you can go from the original price with being called a scammer.

On another note, I know for a fact that you can buy keys for less than 7 ref, and although the majority of people may not all buy keys under 7 ref, It still is possible and should not be blindly changed because it takes extra time to buy a key for 6.66. If we in fact have to raise the price of keys or any item of that matter, I assure you we won't need to change it after it was changed 1-2 weeks ago. Give us some breathing room!

Ask for the information you couldn't properly discern, Let me put it a bit simpler. Lets say you can buy a key for $2.30, and the price of refined is .30 cents. 2.3 % .30 is 7.66. So, It would take 7.66 refined metal to balance all three values. Along comes backpack.tf and says "Hey! Keys are worf 8 ref now!" Now everyone in their mother is selling/ buying keys around 8 ref. Now what I can do is buy a bunch of keys for $2.3. So, I lost 2.3 dollers and I have one key. I sell the key for 8 ref, then I sell each ref for .30 cents. 8*.30 is $2.4. I made ten cents. yay. This may not sound like a lot, but it adds up over time. I know people who do this method, and it works well for them. I'm just saying. There is probably a better way than just to Raise! Raise! Raise the price of keys!

Sorry for my advanced b.s. vocabulary, even though the only fancy-shmancy words I used was inopportune and plus-or-minus, which is just basic math.

The price of refined in paypal cash will not remain anywhere near 30 cents as the price of keys in refined continues to increase

But people have been doing this! Right under our noses! There are people who sell keys around $1.80. People buy them only to sell them for a few refined metals, then they sell that refined metal for .30 cents and make a profit that is, in my opinion, unfair to us traders who don't use paypal. Since refined doesn't get changes as much as keys do (About months between accepted offers), this will still get abused. there are many other disadvantages to rapidly inflating the key price, but this issue is, i feel, under-looked and should be noted. There probably is a better alternative than just raising the prices, and there definatly is some greedy characters involved, but we need to look at what we are doing once and a while and see if what we're doing makes SENSE. RAISING THE PRICE OF KEYS AFTER 6 DAYS DOES NOT MAKE ANY SENSE. PERIOD.

Of course paypal trading isn't fair to regular traders; PP trading carries numerous inherent risks, so the prices are naturally going to reflect that.

That's one reason why the ref that makes up a key is worth more--it takes 7 trades to sell it all instead of one, so the seller is taking more risks by selling metal instead of keys.

"YOU CAN STILL SELL A KEY BELOW 7 REF"

You can sell a key at any price. I could give them away for free if I wanted to.

gibe keez plox

Oops. I meant buy :P How silly of me.

Upvoted, I can't buy keys for 7 ref!! LOL.

This system is bad -.- we're not even voting on the price. we're just voting on if we think it'll be accepted or not. This is one way of tricking the community of thinking they actually matter in voting though :D

I wouldnt be surprised if keys surpass buds in pricing.

Well buds are fixed with keys, so, yeah. And refined can be easily obtained by idling for a few hours boom 2.33 ref in a week? lol free key? juejuejeue

http://www.tf2outpost.com/trade/17052363 (apparently sold 97)

Just saying his bp proves he didnt sell 97. Just a pointer compared to all these analogies and amazing arguments. But yea..

I would like to know, who is the first person who decided to increase the key values to begin with.

to answer your question.. This is the guy responsible for raising key prices c:

http://i.imgur.com/l9d7r4i.png

Long218 is his name. hes bst traedr evr +rep

Long218 was not the first person to raise key prices, they were just the least professional about it.

There's a topic about it on the forums, this isn't the place to discuss it.

This is sound proof. Keys prices are not too high. The real focus should be on uncrated items selling below the price of a key (*cough* festives 2013 *cough*).

*cough* damage dealt being worth more than a damn salvaged strange*cough*

Upvote. Deal with it.

Just because people are over pricing them in sales doesn't mean to raise the set price. If you set it to 7.11-7.22, the keybot sellers are going to increase their prices to 7.44.

After that happens, 12-16 days later, backpack will vote the price to 7.44 with "proof". When THAT happens, the keybot sellers will increase prices to 7.55.

DO NOT set the official suggested prices based on people who over price the keys to make a profit. Let the price stay the same for a while for a change. Let the market breath.

If the market doesn't settle, and breath, this key price bubble will burst, and EVERYONE will lose a lot of money on them. Imagine this....8 key buds. It WILL happen if the current key trend stays the same.

P.S. I am already seeing people in trade servers saying things like:

"I don't care if backpack says it's more later on, I'm not going to sell or buy keys for more than 7."

"7 is already a ridiculous price if it goes up higher, the market is going to suffer"

etc, etc.

are all trades made for profit? not to lose money?

I was on Skial yesterday, so a seller join and tried to sell 8 keys at 7.11 then everyone started to complain, then he lowered down his price to 7 ref and started finding buyers at that price. I was one of them, bought 1 key from him at 7 ref for a good friend of mine. :P

So yes, you have a valid point there. It seems like not many buyers are willing to pay over 7 ref.

the funny thing about these key suggestions is that only until the suggestion passes its too easy to buy keys for current price; only when the suggestion passes people actually start selling for higher:/ seems artificial to me.

In-case this helps.

http://www.tf2outpost.com/trade/17115399

Sold 2 for 7.11ref each instantly.

Good luck on your suggestion ♫

There's enough counter proof to trump this suggestion completely. Oh but wait it's a key suggestion it'll be accepted no matter what.

Alright, I'll try again

http://www.tf2outpost.com/trade/17067961

As you can see, a guy bought a key for 7 ref. Can you please re-consider this?

I can just upvote, put 3 keys up in Outpost, in less then 5 minutes i sold 3 for 7,11 each. Dont know how to screenshot that or else i had some screenshots.

As items become more common, their prices go down and as they have accepted, stable prices the only other thing that can change is the value of keys. I dont mind them going up but I think the abundance of bots is overtaking the market

You already posted this twice.

Haha, I know right. If you want keys to slow down or even stop rising, how about you buy from the Mann Co. Store? Steam Market is only shifting keys around and not adding any new ones to the game.

i've had steam for 3 years and i'm just level 8 :/

Put mine key yesterday on classifieds only for 7.22. Sold it like in 5 minutes. Sadly, but upvote

Greater key price = wider margins for all Items priced greater than 1 key. People may complain that higher key price hurts new traders but it also helps mid-low level traders that have just a couple keys in their backpack actually make a profit.

Also, I have yet to see a key traded on a trade server for more than 7 ref.

There will be a day where buying Key from Mann.Co Store will be cheaper and from trading it will be more expensive.

I believe that the raising price of keys is good because of the dropping economy in America and the over-inflation of refine in the inventory

Concensus is that 7 ref trades are still happening too frequently to ignore, supported by proof of many successful buyers at that price. Suggested range would put 7 ref trades on equal grounds with 7.33 ref trades, which doesn't fit right given what's been provided.

Given the combination of proof, relevant comments, and counterproof, suggested price is a bit too high. Closing.