Suggestion: Earbuds at 24 keys

Second link here. I've not sold any for 25 keys yet, but I've sold a few for 24 keys + varying amounts of ref/items a few days ago. I do agree that 25 keys is too much, but I think a range of 24-24.5 would be better than 24 flat.

A suggestion for 24-24.5 just got scrapped by Vincent yesterday. Apparently they are paranoid about the decimals.

"Too many sales still happening at 25 keys, as in the comments. Votes overall negative.

Closing."

This was the reason given by Vincent and when he means votes overall negative its just a difference of 49 votes. (+389, -438). I do not see a pewny difference of just 49 votes on such a huge currency - anywhere even close to being called OVERALL.

To close that suggestion was totally wrong from Vincent. Once he sees the amount of unsold earbuds @ 25 or the huge volume sold at about 24 keys + 2/3 ref compared to the ones sold @ 25 as he claimed was shown on the earlier closed suggestion (clearly that was not the case), I wonder if he would then care to answer to the community.

Well the thing is, most people immediatley upvote if they see links. They don't actually bother to check the links to see if it's valid.

Yup, I agree. But there is no where in his comments where he has shown concern in his comments as to who voted positively or negatively nor has shown concern about the reasons of peoples' up or down votes. So I don't see how that argument defends his decision.

Not defending anything, I'm just saying, mindless masses upvote without checking the proof.

It is school holidays now :(, so expect more of them.

Unsolds aren't valid proof. The concensus in the comments was that they were still seeing success selling at 25 keys. The votes were overall negative, and even the suggester had declared that he wanted the outcome of his suggestion decided by the votes. It was a very simple decision.

Mate if that's the case then this suggestion can be closed too :) Only unsolds at the top there.

I would, but when my judgement gets called into question on a recent suggestion of the same item, I always leave it to another admin to handle.

Mate if the basis of the closure is a fact accepted and approved by all admins, I don't think anyone shall raise questions on your judgement.

Moreover it is evident from the suggestion that sales at 24 + 'x" ref is happening so 24 flat can't be accepted anyway.

Although I am desperately trying to sell my ear bud for 24 keys from past 10 hours without any success :(.

Edit: Managed to sell my earbud for 24 keys after 12 hours of bumping :).

hmmm... you may show that it is very hard to sell at 24.1-25 you kinda did, but 24 flat isnt the right price. I think earbuds are even gonna increase someday.

stop showing proof for unsold items and only show proof of sold items. Just because it has been unsold for a week doesnt mean the price needs to drop. I have waited weeks before selling an item full price.

& really you are showing unsold buds that have been up barely a day & a lot of the 25 keys for buds have buyers so it doesnt make sense when you clearly show proof for buyers of 25 keys and you mark the price down

http://www.tf2outpost.com/trade/11651815

technically it's 10X more difficult to show sold items since once trades are complete they're no longer searchable. simply quoting half completed trades would be wrong since that is only sampling from a minority of actual trades. only way is to monitor unsolds to see if they eventually sell within a few days.

Meh, I just sold 2 buds today for 25 keys each. C:

12 June: http://puu.sh/3dOqO.png

many of your ''unsolds'' have already sold.

Fyi buying and bought for 25

-->http://www.tf2outpost.com/trade/11637654

I sold 2 for 25 keys yesterday....

http://awesomescreenshot.com/0711dzko00

um you traded with triper a friend from me just want to tell you the sadly fact that his accout got hacked and now all of his good items are gone(dont know why i tell you this but it is crazy that you just traded with him and i see it here, hopefully you traded with him and not with the hacker...)

there are alot of earbuds in outpost and they are very expensive so it could take a while to sell them but that dosnt mean that they will be unsold forever at this price. your unsolded proofs were around 1-2days in outpost and if you look now at some them many of them were just sold.

One of the 25's up there, [11270149]. Well, I've sold some at 25. Yesterday I sold 2 to one person. But I restock them almost immediately.

seem ok, upvote!

1. You have duplicates of several of your "unsold" links.

2. Prices can not be based solely on unsold trades like you currently are.

3. http://backpack.tf/vote/id/51b63a124bd7b8dd43000004 Read Vincent's last comment at the bottom of that suggestion.

The thing is i can always go to the outpost and find tons of unsolds.It's what its made for. you know people CLOSE their trades if they sold theirs. If you really want me to say: We can't see closed trades. so "unsolds" are not good proof.

I think that now with trade.tf you can see any past good deals that you have missed.

i hope people don't start relying on trade.tf too much. the data there seems inherently flawed as there is no way it can track trades which occur with instant adds but no comment on the trade. also, often times comments in trade doesn't equate to the actual trade made, in other words it is only using a small subset of data and is still very much innacurate when compared to trawling outpost/trade servers and making judgements yourself.

I agree, but at least it does the dirty work of sorting out the data for you. Any discrepancies can be resolved with human intervention - just click on the link and check yourself :).

not true. first of all it uses bots to intepret the data. as we know even a big shot company like apple hasn't been able to create a software which understands human language context well. also, since a lot or most of the relevant data doesn't even show up on trade.tf. you'd probably do much better clicking through the links that people have posted on these suggestions.

Cool, but I think the OP wants to track the deals that are not in the links above. Is there anyway that we can do that?

i've pointed it out somewhere else that the only way is to find unsold trades both at upper and lower limits and monitor them over a few days. it is tedious but it would also be more accurate.

Ah so it has to be done the old fashioned way. :(. Thank you for the info, though. Cheers.

Unsold links are not valid proof. Even if they were, most of them, if not all of them are less than a week old. Buyers aren't very substantial; anybody who is trying to find a trade of somebody buying their item probably will be smart enough to realize that they won't pay full price.

Saying that, the 7 links which you have presented of willing sellers at 24 Keys does not dictate the market. Some trades have sold some for 25 Keys as well. The current range is fine.

Just clicking around on a couple unsolds for 25 and I see quite a few of them that are actually sold....

Leaving my trade here for some ~~advertisement~~ proof, that the current top range might be a bit too high. :P

http://www.tf2outpost.com/trade/11205846

Changed my price a day or two ago from 25 keys to 24 keys + 3 ref and no sale for now.

Oh hey, look at the classified: http://backpack.tf/classifieds/search/earbuds

This is all from your own unsold proof. Several have sold and/or have offers above 24 keys.

http://www.tf2outpost.com/trade/11552125 Offered 24 + a BP Expander

http://www.tf2outpost.com/trade/11474780 Sold for 25 keys

http://www.tf2outpost.com/trade/11624798 Sold.

http://www.tf2outpost.com/trade/11407885 Has sold atleast 2 this week for 25 keys

http://www.tf2outpost.com/trade/11044604 Had 1-2 buyers at 25 keys this week

http://www.tf2outpost.com/trade/11493271 Offered 25 keys 5 days ago

http://www.tf2outpost.com/trade/11575592 Had a buyer at 25 keys

http://www.tf2outpost.com/trade/11640115 Offered a Big Kill + Black Bills + 2 keys (25 keys in promos and keys)

http://www.tf2outpost.com/trade/11561136 Sold one for 25 keys 13 hours ago

http://www.tf2outpost.com/trade/11284812 Was offered 24 keys + 1 key in items

http://www.tf2outpost.com/trade/10850044 Offered 24 keys + 3 ref

http://www.tf2outpost.com/trade/8860092 Several buyers at 25 keys in the past week, most recent being 2 days ago.

http://www.tf2outpost.com/trade/3050415 Sold atleast 1 for 25 keys this week 3 days ago

http://www.tf2outpost.com/trade/11599167 Sold. No longer valid unsold proof.

http://www.tf2outpost.com/trade/11465008 Offered 23 keys + 2 keys in metal

http://www.tf2outpost.com/trade/11590463 Sold and was offered 24 keys + 3 ref

http://bazaar.tf/trade/236289 Offered 25 keys a week ago

http://www.tf2outpost.com/trade/9952916 Had atleast 1 buyer this week

http://www.tf2outpost.com/trade/11648945 Sold

http://www.tf2outpost.com/trade/11595779 Sold atleast 1 for 25 keys

http://www.tf2outpost.com/trade/11651815 Sold

http://www.tf2outpost.com/trade/11540497 Has a buyer at 25 keys

http://www.tf2outpost.com/trade/10324444 Had a buyer at 25 keys 3 days ago

All of these you have more than once as "proof". You probably have more but I'm already tired of going through these links.

http://www.tf2outpost.com/trade/11421619 This is linked 2 times

http://www.tf2outpost.com/trade/11638011 This is linked 2 times

http://bazaar.tf/trade/252737 This is linked 2 times

http://www.tf2outpost.com/trade/11598933 This is linked 2 times

http://www.tf2outpost.com/trade/11649655 This is linked 2 times

All these are way too young to consider as unsold proof.

http://bazaar.tf/trade/254686

http://bazaar.tf/trade/254110

http://www.tf2outpost.com/trade/11638582

http://www.tf2outpost.com/trade/11646346

http://www.tf2outpost.com/trade/11633816

http://www.tf2outpost.com/trade/11630944

http://www.tf2outpost.com/trade/11638011

http://www.tf2outpost.com/trade/11650505

http://www.tf2outpost.com/trade/11642517

http://www.tf2outpost.com/trade/11644719

http://www.tf2outpost.com/trade/11650890

http://www.tf2outpost.com/trade/11640115

http://www.tf2outpost.com/trade/11649655

http://www.tf2outpost.com/trade/11637497

http://www.tf2outpost.com/trade/11641229

http://www.tf2outpost.com/trade/11632534

http://www.tf2outpost.com/trade/11645056

http://www.tf2outpost.com/trade/11650218

http://www.tf2outpost.com/trade/11651615

http://www.tf2outpost.com/trade/11642561

http://www.tf2outpost.com/trade/11650440

http://www.tf2outpost.com/trade/11638228

http://www.tf2outpost.com/trade/11619444

http://www.tf2outpost.com/trade/11625325

http://www.tf2outpost.com/trade/11625559

http://bazaar.tf/trade/252737

http://www.tf2outpost.com/trade/11622093

http://www.tf2outpost.com/trade/11637654 Buyer at 25 keys

Tons at classifieds for less than 25 and not a hard find on outpost . I don't see a reason to pay more.

I think you are forgetting the fact that buds are a very expensive item, and it's not like anyone could afford them. Only a few TF2 traders are able to buy them, so of course they take time to sell.

Personally I sold quite a few buds for 25. It appears that it is basically impossible for me to buy them at 23, so I had to hunt down trades selling for 24 or more. I think the current range is just fine.

http://www.tf2outpost.com/trade/11410276

http://www.tf2outpost.com/trade/11442232

Not very good proof

http://backpack.tf/vote/id/51b63a124bd7b8dd43000004 Just closed, the 24-25 one closed 14 hours ago.

Nice try but ze price aint goin down

25 is a hard sell. 24 keys + 3.00 is a slow sale..24 keys + 2.00, wasn't hard to sell.

http://www.tf2outpost.com/trade/11463960

That's why the 24-24.5 suggestion should have been accepted not this.

Earbuds never accepts a .5 suggestion. So it will never be accurate til the community changes their mind.

This is what Vincent has too say about unsolds,

"Here's the issue. You point out how the trader has been unsold for a week+. But how do we know the circumstances of the item being unsold? Has the trader been active at all since putting it up? How many times has someone added them to buy, they weren't available, and that trader ended up buying from a different trade? Has it indeed been listed at 5 keys over the entire week, rather than having been at 5.5 or 6 during that entire situation and only recently dropped to 5?

Unsolds are just too fickle, with too many unseen factors that may lead to them being unfairly represented as 'unsold'. Willing sellers at lower prices are FAR better representative of a price dropping. When traders have too much trouble at a price or see too much competition, they drop their prices to secure that sale. The harder it is too sell at higher range, the more traders there are available trying to sell at lower range. That kind of activity is a far better representation of what's happening in the market than unsolds."

He used this on my Vintage Procedures Mask which costs 4.5 keys now because I provided a little more proof of sales for 4.5, and he will close this unlesss you can come up with a LOT of earbuds for sale @ 24 keys due to the fact this is what TF2 economy is based on for unusuals.

This unsold theory definately does not apply to the earbuds. These are like Godlike items and everyone and everyone and everyone wants them.

Lol earbuds godlike... any kid who has a senseable mind for trading and can spot a good trade can have buds. They aren't even that nice, and most experinced traders prefer unusuals over buds unless you are involved in paypal... but I can see where you are coming from

lol unusual over buds? mate you are living in a dream world. Every experienced trader out there is after buds to quick-sell the shit out of his next purchase. Unusual hats are seldom accepted where the seller has tried his luck enough to acknowledge that he has a shit unusual and its better of to trade it for a different unusual and try his luck again or when the price of the unusual hat is so high that its easier to break it off into lesser value unusual then to wait for a person with ear-buds. but at the very end of the day it comes back to buds.

Things are different if you talk about a collector but there are very very few of them out there and moreover they always buy buds with money and would not be bothered with prices of ear buds in key unless its relatively cheap, which often is not.

And I wonder the suggestions are approved on a good kid theory? If they where then price would not have elevated to 25 keys in the first place. Speaking sensibly, every buyer would have been patient and sellers thus would have been force to sell for lower. Alas, that is not the case.

And as far as pay pal is concerned as average ear buds cost $40, and a key cost $1.75. The bud therefore equates to about 22.85-23 keys.

And ear-buds are wanted by everyone, it is more required as a currency then a wearable commodity.

This proof SUCKS. A lot of the earbuds you listed unsold at 25 are 1 or 2 days old OR YOUNGER. And many of them have SOLD NOW.

Can you look at the proof you list CLOSELY before you post a suggestion of this caliber??

"most hated person"

go make a key suggestion

It's obvious he wants a ban for such rude behavior in the comments of this suggestion, or at the very least is trying to get it closed.

Which person wants a ban?

Well some deductive reasoning leads me to believe his comment is directed Rogue for which I assume he mistook as the suggester since neither of ThatOtherChigga's comments are bad nor has the suggester even commented since he posted this suggestion. What lead me to think he was thinking about Rogue is due to the little flame war they were having slightly above this comment thread. It seems Jinjo is being slightly arrogant if he thinks that only Rogue should be banned for harassment towards other users through use of slander and petty name-calling.

well you are wrong your trade yourself provide counter proof showwing the current is right.

http://www.tf2outpost.com/trade/11541701-your trade sold 10+ at 25

http://www.tf2outpost.com/trade/11610507-your trade bought 4 at 24

still proof showing people will sell/buy fine at 24-25

there are barely any proof for selling at 24. which mean that this still pull more than 24 flat.

25 might be too much, but 24 flat isnt the price.

downvote

Lol, economy is getting worse in tf2 and world, but either way I upvoted cuz of good proof

how is it good proof? only unsolds for 25, plenty of counter proof for 24½

ok let's see if this suggestion pass?

sure

wait... didn't I trade with you before?

no idea

I think I did...

lol, the economy is doing worse. The buying power of a key has never been better. You can now buy 4 craft hats for a single key rather than 2 keys. The increase in the number of items and diversity of items has lead to more competitive prices among sellers leading to decreased prices which is great for buyers. The economy is a great place to be a buyer. The introduction of the Steam Market allows you to sell items to buy the games you want instead of having to wait to find someone selling it at a decent price. This whole idea of the economy doing 'worse' stems from an arrogant, one-minded perspective that the TF2 economy is based off a single currency, refined, and therefore keys increasing means there must be impending doom. That's simply not the case if you take a moment to step back and analyze the economy through a different filter than the single focus of keys increasing.

Most of your unsolds are sold now , has some "added" comments, etc, people offering 24+ items or refineds. Most are young too

DOWNVOTE ! they shouldnt go down --'

Just look at the Classifieds http://backpack.tf/stats/143/6/0

http://puu.sh/3ebA6.png

Coincidence? I think not.

The range is still good, fewer are being sold at 25 but there are still buyers at that price.

proof is bad, doesn't show how you can't buy at 25

And most of the "unsolds" are actually sold., yeah is so bad

Most of your "unsolds" are now sold, dude get it over.

http://www.tf2outpost.com/trade/11683503 - 24

http://www.tf2outpost.com/trade/11683480 - 24

http://www.tf2outpost.com/trade/11683409 - 24

http://www.tf2outpost.com/trade/11683286 - 24

http://bazaar.tf/trade/256091 - 24

http://www.tf2outpost.com/trade/11680809 - 23! sold

http://www.tf2outpost.com/trade/11680116 - 24

http://www.tf2outpost.com/trade/11680065 - 24

http://www.tf2outpost.com/trade/11679923 - 24 sold

http://www.tf2outpost.com/trade/11679444 - 24

http://www.tf2outpost.com/trade/11678181 - 24 sold

http://www.tf2outpost.com/trade/11678169 - 24

http://www.tf2outpost.com/trade/11677942 - 24

http://www.tf2outpost.com/trade/11677116 - 24

http://www.tf2outpost.com/trade/11674926 - 24 sold

http://www.tf2outpost.com/trade/11674461 - 24

http://www.tf2outpost.com/trade/11673012 - 23 keys 3 ref

http://www.tf2outpost.com/trade/11672643 - 24 sold

http://www.tf2outpost.com/trade/11672360 - 24

http://www.tf2outpost.com/trade/11672340 - 24 sold

http://www.tf2outpost.com/trade/11671660 - 24 sold

http://www.tf2outpost.com/trade/11671425 - 24

Staying neutral. Sometimes, 25 seems to be possible.

I sold mine for 26 in items very easily

Item over pay....

Well it was 22 keys + blood bk knife which I easily turned that knife in to 4 keys

here:

http://backpack.tf/classifieds/search/earbuds tons @ lower then 25 http://i43.tinypic.com/o1a39.png pages of unsolds at 25

SELLING/SOLD @ 24

http://www.tf2outpost.com/trade/11631411

http://bazaar.tf/trade/253724

http://www.tf2outpost.com/trade/11628409

http://www.tf2outpost.com/trade/11626403

http://bazaar.tf/trade/253499

http://bazaar.tf/trade/253427 6 @ 24

http://www.tf2outpost.com/trade/11622964

http://www.tf2outpost.com/trade/11622741

http://www.tf2outpost.com/trade/11619228

http://www.tf2outpost.com/trade/11617413

http://www.tf2outpost.com/trade/11616360

http://www.tf2outpost.com/trade/11616310

http://www.tf2outpost.com/trade/11614289

http://www.tf2outpost.com/trade/11614038

http://www.tf2outpost.com/trade/11613374

http://www.tf2outpost.com/trade/11613069

http://www.tf2outpost.com/trade/11610750

http://www.tf2outpost.com/trade/11610711

http://www.tf2outpost.com/trade/11607964

http://www.tf2outpost.com/trade/11605894

http://www.tf2outpost.com/trade/11605485

http://www.tf2outpost.com/trade/11603469

http://www.tf2outpost.com/trade/11601870

http://www.tf2outpost.com/trade/11581807

http://www.tf2outpost.com/trade/11581231

http://www.tf2outpost.com/trade/11580517

http://www.tf2outpost.com/trade/11579882

http://www.tf2outpost.com/trade/11577604

http://www.tf2outpost.com/trade/11576616

http://www.tf2outpost.com/trade/11576430

http://bazaar.tf/trade/251467

http://www.tf2outpost.com/trade/11574214

http://www.tf2outpost.com/trade/11573967

http://www.tf2outpost.com/trade/11573830

http://www.tf2outpost.com/trade/11573699

all of that in the last 24 hours^

tons of unsolds at 25 http://www.tf2outpost.com/search/119278355/1

http://backpack.tf/classifieds/search/earbuds/2 5 pages on classifieds 2-5 tons of buds that aren't moving at 25 keys. 24 is entirely possible. Same arguement with keys if this many buds are sold for 24 keys.

succesful buyers for 24 keys/ buyers being offered for 24 keys

http://www.tf2outpost.com/trade/10297178 offer of 24 keys-rejected

http://www.tf2outpost.com/trade/9917688 an add for 23 keys(recent)

http://www.tf2outpost.com/trade/11170319 add for 23

http://www.tf2outpost.com/trade/10802063 1 willing to sell at 24, 1 at 23+3 ref

http://www.tf2outpost.com/trade/11298314 got 4 check bp @23

http://www.tf2outpost.com/trade/11344556 bought 1 bp confirms at 22(5 days ago)

http://www.tf2outpost.com/trade/10807621 6 willing sellers less then a week ago

http://www.tf2outpost.com/trade/11559366 bought 2 at 21 check bp

http://www.tf2outpost.com/trade/11622448 add at 23(2 hours)

http://www.tf2outpost.com/trade/10224025 2 offers of 24

http://www.tf2outpost.com/trade/10822273 add at 22

This is ridiculous the only reason anyone even sells at 24 is because nobody can afford it. there are only 63,000 pairs of buds in tf2 this price should be at a slow and constant ascension.

Demand and currency exchange rates say otherwise

sorry but buds are going for 24.5 keys quite comfortably.and i dont think it makes sense to increase or decrease price for now

A significant portion of your unsolds @25 have sold. Not seeing a problem with the current range.